Looking for seatbelt ideas. There are six of us. Our bus has typical household furniture. We hit the road in June, and the only seatbelt on the bus is in the driver seat.
Buy and bolt in three sets of bus seats with seatbelts. They are often cheap and available on CL. Either that or put people at some elevated level of risk. A seatbelt wrapped over a wooden kitchen chair will be insufficient if called to duty. IMO
Quote from: Astro on April 19, 2017, 07:21:53 AMBuy and bolt in three sets of bus seats with seatbelts. They are often cheap and available on CL. Either that or put people at some elevated level of risk. A seatbelt wrapped over a wooden kitchen chair will be insufficient if called to duty. IMO
A lot of it is down to the anchorage. You can have an ordinary sofa (so long as the sofa is firmly fixed to the floor to carry its own weight) and -- if the anchorages are solid -- the seat belts will work fine. IMO - if it's a situation that puts you in a position that your passengers in a bus* need shoulder straps, it doesn't matter; you're all already going to be dead. Especially, if a passenger's seat if not near the windshield, instrument panel, etc., lap belts -- worn correctly -- are good enough.
(* A bus has significantly different characteristics to a smaller vehicle. Generally, if you hit something hard going very fast, that "something" is usually a car or small truck and the greater mass of the bus will give you a lot of protection. If you hit something hard when you're going fast and what you hit is BIG and HARD, nothing in the front 4-6 feet of the bus will survive. But belts are great to provide quite good protections in side-swipes, in-traffic bumps, and slow intersection accidents; plus every driver should be belted to keep the driver in the seat during "difficult conditions" (don't forget, many accidents are multiple, you hit something that deflects you into hitting something else -- if the driver is thrown from the seat by the first hit, from then on, you're all just passengers with no way to influence things.)
The only seat belts required in an RV/Bus Conversion is the driver and front passenger. I have a recliner a few feet back and I have a seat belt for it, and I bought three seat belts for the couch, but have never installed them because I need to weld a steel bar behind the couch to attach the belts to. It's on the list of things to do....
--Geoff
If you're looking for new, I got mine here
http://www.andoauto.com/index.htm (http://www.andoauto.com/index.htm)
A lesson I learned through the near death of two family friends...
Make sure the furniture is secured to the frame, and the belts as well. My bus has several locations I'm looking at when I put the interior back together.
If you have not already done so...do NOT remove the stainless panel in the front on the curbside. I know many folks take it out with the seats, but it's there for a reason...it acts as a grab bar entering the bus, but it's also a safety curtain for your co-captain.
And although this goes a bit beyond seatbelts, make sure EVERYTHING inside the bus is secured so that should you need to stop quickly, nothing can become a hazard...flying up to the front at speeds that might surprise you...and hitting anyone in the way.
Just curious, what percentage of bus conversions even have seatbelts behind the driver/co-pilot seating? For so long even school buses had no passenger seat belts, it sure makes sense but it seems many subject passengers to being flying projectiles in case of hard stop or crash.
Quote from: windtrader on April 20, 2017, 03:09:04 PM
Just curious, what percentage of bus conversions even have seatbelts behind the driver/co-pilot seating? For so long even school buses had no passenger seat belts, it sure makes sense but it seems many subject passengers to being flying projectiles in case of hard stop or crash.
Long story but school buses are different. Other things are going on.
Meh. In a crash we all expect to rattle around inside our bus like dried apples in a barrel.
Look both ways when you cross the street
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Put in seat belts for every seat. My university employer required a safe driving course for everyone driving one of their vehicles. They showed a couple of videos from dash cams pointed at the drivers (commercial rigs to make sure drivers were being safe) during accidents. The drivers were tossed around like pop corn in an air popper with zero control. After a couple of flips the driver went right out the window. In another, a Kleenex box was sitting on the deck by the back window. In the accident the box kept going forward and hit the driver in the back of the head and killed him. Fasten everything down. We all think an accident won't happen to us. In college I was in a bus on the Mass Pike that slid of the road and tipped over.
Are you asking about seatbelts for the household furniture? If so, I don't think there will be much benefit as the seats weren't designed to provide the necessary passenger support for the seatbelt to function properly ( seatbelt could cause more harm). The forces created in a collision may surprise you.
My thoughts/ opinion - - -
If passenger safety is the concern - buy real vehicle seats that are designed to work with seatbelts. And install them properly!
A seatbelt is part of a complex system - A system that must be properly designed and properly installed.
Good luck & safe travels ;D
I'm with Kyle. If you do want passengers secured during a collision you'll need to get NTSB approved seats that are properly bolted into the frame along with approved restraints. Then go through the entire coach to have it engineered and constructed to ensure stuff won't go break loose and fly around hitting a secured passenger. I'm new to all this but I doubt there are but a handful of converted coaches that would pass a full NTSB crash test.
Sticks and staples as they are called here have had seat belts on every sitting place since the 80's.The seat belts in our Trek sure don't look like a complex engineering marvel,the 3 point belt for the driver and passenger look ok.
It is dumb for people not to wear a seat belt but here in AZ the driver or anyone in front area are not required to wear seat belts and I think CA is the same.The last I read only 1/2 the states require a driver or co-polit to wear a seat belt when driving a RV
Here is, in my experience driving charter buses and motorhomes for 40 years.
Going down the road with a charter group, the escort is standing up talking to her folks. The folks are up getting something out of the overhead parcel racks, or walking down the isle to the bathroom, or standing up visiting with one another.
In a motorhome while I am driving, the wife and kids are lying on the couch or the bed having a snooze, up using the bathroom, in the kitchen making a sandwich or fixing a drink. My kids when little would have a shower while going down the interstate a 70 mph.
So yea, ideally everyone should be seated and belted while under way, but in real life, they are not.
It is very important that the driver drive in a smooth, defensive manner, to keep his passengers safe.
So don't sweat the small stuff. Go down the road and enjoy yourself. Just the driver has to be super diligent.
JC
Quote from: lostagain on April 29, 2017, 08:02:08 PM
Here is, in my experience driving charter buses and motorhomes for 40 years.
Going down the road with a charter group, the escort is standing up talking to her folks. The folks are up getting something out of the overhead parcel racks, or walking down the isle to the bathroom, or standing up visiting with one another.
In a motorhome while I am driving, the wife and kids are lying on the couch or the bed having a snooze, up using the bathroom, in the kitchen making a sandwich or fixing a drink. My kids when little would have a shower while going down the interstate a 70 mph.
So yea, ideally everyone should be seated and belted while under way, but in real life, they are not.
I agree Sonja has made me a many snacks going down the road lol how do strap a woman into a seat belt laying on the sofa reading a book just asking ;D
Yep I agree Sonja has made me a many of snacks going down the road lol how would strap a seat belt on a woman laying on the coach reading a book just asking ;D
It is very important that the driver drive in a smooth, defensive manner, to keep his passengers safe.
So don't sweat the small stuff. Go down the road and enjoy yourself. Just the driver has to be super diligent.
JC
Quote from: luvrbus on April 29, 2017, 07:32:35 PM
Sticks and staples as they are called here have had seat belts on every sitting place since the 80's.The seat belts in our Trek sure don't look like a complex engineering marvel
Most of what I have seen in motorhomes (behind the driver) looks more like a cosmetic after thought. . . . . engineering doesn't come to mind. Come to think of it, as far as the body & interior, I don't see much engineering in any of the sticks & staples motorhomes, let alone crash safety engineering.
While I hope to never need them, if I was going to the trouble to add seatbelts, I would want to be sure that they would keep the occupant safely restrained in the seat, as opposed to trapped while the seat tries to push them thru the seatbelt.
That said, I don't feel comfortable driving without a seat belt. I also don't see the benefit of one on the couch if you are lying down.
We all take our chances with the choices we make . . . .
Per rvshare.com:
"Recreational Vehicle manufacturers are ONLY required to comply to seat belt standards for the front passengers, not any rear occupants that may be traveling in the rig.” ...... Note: Remember that each manufacturer has different ways of testing their seat belts and there are no defined industry standards for these tests.
So in effect, their backseat belts are bogus and feel-good decorations.
In addition, I am not sure what “testing” is conducted on their plywood/fiberglass boxes in regards to crash protection, but I will take an old full size bus any day over a S&S. In effect, there is very little regulation over the RV industry in regards to safety outside of brakes but there is a lot in the public transportation industry from which our buses originate.
In Australia all bus to motorhome conversions have to have seat belts fitted and engineered to goverment safety standard ADR (Australian Design Rules)regulations with a compliance plate fitted to the bus.
The engineer must be accredited by the road authorities around $1000 AU plus to sign of the job.
If you have 4 beds you must have 4 seat belted approved strength seats side facing seats can only have lap seat belts and all forward facing seats lap sash unless it's an aisle seat but they prefer lap sash
Our bus conversions must meet ADR regulations and have a plate fitted by the engineer before it can be registered as a motorhome all fixings inside must meet the engineers report for strength in case of an accident the it will not fly around
James
I liked the having a shower while driving ! my son did that in our first s/s rv and it had a 2 ' x 2 ' shower cube in it so if the bar of soap fell he had to GET OUT OF THE SHOWER to pick it up then continue l
as for safety ??? I knew nothing about rvs when I bought the 1st one . it was a deal $ 4000 for a 32 ' gaser with a 454 on the road . then as I was changing things to the way I wanted them I asked my buddy the rv guy why I can't find any steel frame ????? as he put it only the drivers area forward had a steel frame ???? and on the vertical frames at the door to get in . so I found that the rear end and corners were all made out of one 2 x 4 and 2 x 2 s ???? ya safety all the way . sold that one in a hurry
up here in the great white north you have to have seat belts for every one inside when driving . now saying that on the 20000 featherlite it only has lap belts on the driver and passenger seats ?? and no other seat belts ???? I had to add them
dave
Quote from: luvrbus on April 29, 2017, 07:32:35 PM
Sticks and staples as they are called here have had seat belts on every sitting place since the 80's.The seat belts in our Trek sure don't look like a complex engineering marvel,the 3 point belt for the driver and passenger look ok.
It is dumb for people not to wear a seat belt but here in AZ the driver or anyone in front area are not required to wear seat belts and I think CA is the same.The last I read only 1/2 the states require a driver or co-polit to wear a seat belt when driving a RV
Texass is $175.00...for improper use....as in putting your arm outside the shoulder harness...Ft.Hancock needs the $$$ :( probably double that if just plain not buckled
Some our Australian fines for Victoria
Failing to wear a seat belt $466
Failing for a small child wear seat belt $311 driver pays
Passenger under 16 not wearing a seat belt $350 driver pays
Driver failing to enforce an adult not using a seat belt $311 driver pays but passenger find as well $466
Touching or using a mobile phone $466
Not going into an open weight station (over 4.5 ton) $1555
Exceeding wight buy up to 1 ton $233
All or fines also attract demerit points at different values, failing to wear a seat belt 4 points or touching/using a phone 4 points you get 12 points every 3 years to use and every offence deducts from them so a speeding fine can take all points in one go, as well exceeding speed by 40k/25mph loss of licence and 30 days impoundment of the car and the time lost is connected to the speed above 25mph repeat offenders will end up with the car crushed no if's no buts
We have had compulsory seat belt wearing since 1968
Just an insight of how diferant country's enforce seat belt regulations
James
Ps love the forum and the magazine every month
Quote from: lostagain on April 29, 2017, 08:02:08 PM
Here is, in my experience driving charter buses and motorhomes for 40 years.
Going down the road with a charter group, the escort is standing up talking to her folks. The folks are up getting something out of the overhead parcel racks, or walking down the isle to the bathroom, or standing up visiting with one another.
In a motorhome while I am driving, the wife and kids are lying on the couch or the bed having a snooze, up using the bathroom, in the kitchen making a sandwich or fixing a drink. My kids when little would have a shower while going down the interstate a 70 mph.
So yea, ideally everyone should be seated and belted while under way, but in real life, they are not.
It is very important that the driver drive in a smooth, defensive manner, to keep his passengers safe.
So don't sweat the small stuff. Go down the road and enjoy yourself. Just the driver has to be super diligent.
JC
Amazing philosophy
QuoteWe all take our chances with the choices we make . . . .
Not so much a problem for consenting adults, but to force your choice on to children and grandchildren is surely indefensible
Quote from: Slug on April 30, 2017, 01:03:14 AM
In Australia all bus to motorhome conversions have to have seat belts fitted and engineered to goverment safety standard ADR (Australian Design Rules)regulations with a compliance plate fitted to the bus.
The engineer must be accredited by the road authorities around $1000 AU plus to sign of the job.
If you have 4 beds you must have 4 seat belted approved strength seats side facing seats can only have lap seat belts and all forward facing seats lap sash unless it's an aisle seat but they prefer lap sash
Our bus conversions must meet ADR regulations and have a plate fitted by the engineer before it can be registered as a motorhome all fixings inside must meet the engineers report for strength in case of an accident the it will not fly around
James
And even more revolutionary, every driver has to have a license endorsement for the class of vehicle being driven so no hopping in a 15 tonne tag axle motorhome and driving away with just a car license.
Two different worlds guys here they a lack on RV safety and that is not going to change the lobbyist will make sure of that.We are a country of 300 million people and about 1/4 of those own RV's and our death rate is not that high in RV's but even 1 death is to many IMO
Quote from: Tony LEE on May 01, 2017, 05:27:08 AM
Not so much a problem for consenting adults, but to force your choice on to children and grandchildren is surely indefensible
I assume you are talking about the use of seatbelts, because there are many choices I forced on my children that were/ are most definitely defensible ;D
We are still trying to figure this one out! We really appreciate all the great ideas and advice! After pulling up the plyboard on the floor we realized there wasn't much to work with just the single track down the middle that the original seats were in. Our next thought is jump seats along a wall. Any idea if the steel in the frame would work for this type of situation or has anyone done this?
Standard seat belt webbing has a tensile strength of around 5000 to 6000 pounds.
So, if your attachment points can resist that much force, you should be fine, provided the seat stays put . . . .