Seeing one on Scott and Heather's steering wheel, I thought this would make for a good discussion.
I personally don't like them, but some people do.
A look at Wikipedia on the subject https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brodie_knob, brings up the history of the spinners.
They came about when steering was manual, and are not popular anymore with power steering. They are dangerous because they can hit your hand or wrist, or catch your sleeve when the wheel centers itself rapidly. Interesting to find out that they are illegal in Canada. Many trucking and bus companies do not allow them. Around here, some farmers like them on their tractors and combines, some do not.
Who uses one? and who doesn't? That could be a survey.
JC
I'm interested in this topic. There was one on my wheel in the past and left a mark. I've considered putting one on again.
But I don't want to impede the control of the wheel.
It seems a good grip on the spinner would be superior in a panic situation to the wheel itself.
Love to hear the additional thoughts.
I would think the spinner would be in the way in an emergency.
I was trained 40 years ago to hold the wheel at 10 and 2 o'clock, and most importantly, to keep all fingers on the outside of it, so they don't get caught in the spokes.
JC
Quote from: Tikvah on December 02, 2016, 07:39:41 AM... It seems a good grip on the spinner would be superior in a panic situation to the wheel itself. ...
Just a thought but a big part of my job for 20 years was vehicle safety. I've sat through hundreds of hours of research meetings and discussions, run crash tests, evaluated accidents, etc. Every nerve in my brain is telling me that there's nothing better than the 10/2 grip on the wheel in a panic situation -- and if there is, you'll know it at the time but it's not likely to be a spinner knob. I don't know enough to discuss the issue of the fact that one might be in the way or catch on something. Just my WAIG .... (I'd use one to back into a tight parking place or pulling out of a fuel pump area if someone is partially blocking the exit, but not on the road.)
Back when the "undocumented foreign citizen" driving drunk and being chased by the police at 110 MPH+ hit my car and flipped me upside down in the ditch, I remember thinking as my car was sliding along on its roof "Is it better to hang on the wheel and steady myself that way or take my hands off the wheel and wrap my forearms around my head to protect my head". I kept both hands on the wheel and (with the help of the shotgun-shell seat belts and the side air bags - thanks Mr. VW!), I walked away from it although my car had rolled over side-to-side and flipped end over end. I like 10/2.
Quote from: lostagain on December 02, 2016, 07:50:30 AM... I was trained 40 years ago to hold the wheel at 10 and 2 o'clock, and most importantly, to keep all fingers on the outside of it, so they don't get caught in the spokes.
Yep, especially thumbs. You might have a very slightly better grip with your thumbs inside the steering wheel but not if they're broken -- and if something has happened wild enough to break them, then you *really* need to not have them broken. Been there, seen it happen ...
I have one on my tractor and we had them on all our tractors on the farm. With a tractor you do a lot of turning a bus not so much. And I have been beat up by many of them on the farm. Would not have one on the bus reminds me to much of the farm and makes the bus wheel look like a tractor
Wayne
My wheel is 1/2 the size of that one, but that thing would drive me crazy. I always drive 10/2...and built a foldaway table that I keep up for my Ice cup, phone etc...
So log me as a no way.
They are a nice bit of nostalgia, brings back memories of manual steering and the term "knuckle buster", which was very accurate. I do not recommend them, and some companies have prohibited them from use on their equipment.
Interesting that I'm hearing a couple of you mention using these with manual steering. I would think the opposite would be true... that using one with power steering would be ideal. Using one with a hard-to-turn wheel would be almost impossible.
I remember trying to turn a bus, and if it wasn't moving I would literally need to stand up to turn the wheel. I'm not doing that with one hand on a spinner knob.
However, with power steering, trying to back into a space, being able to spin left, spin right, easily would be advantageous. Or hitting a pot-hole at 60mph, the wheel won't snap like the old manual steering, it has ... .well, power.
Help me understand.
Steering wheels were bigger with manuals, and there were more turns lock to lock, and as long as you were moving (and had adequate strength) you could use it to turn quicker.
I was told by a DOT officer they were illegal in a commercial vehicle and received a ticket from him as well back in the 90's while I was still trucking!
;D BK ;D
I think they work great when mounted at 12:oclock on my tractor and others I have used, either power steer or not.
If using the 10 & 2 position we train, test and get tested for in driving its not in my opinion in the way.
I do recall when we took them off steer wheels as a company thing ?late 70's, like a lot of beneficial things they get used for an excuse and so get the easy oust.
I recall the other day mention air ride seats and pot holes, uh the roof! if your just average height is pretty hard in some truck cabs, which should we remove the seat or the roof hehehe
Floyd
I steer 90% of the time only with my left hand (from 21 years of driving 13spd). If they made a legal steering wheel that was just one spoke leading to a spinner knob, that's how I would drive. There are fork lifts made without steering wheels and just a spinner knob so to use your right hand to operate the hydraulics. Good Luck, TomC
During the last years that my Mom was driving, her left hand was injured to the point that it was just about useless. We put a spinner knob on her steering wheel-it was mounted inside the rim so it didn't get in the way of a normal driving. Good Luck, TomC
Illegal in registered vehicles in Pa.
The construction of the human wrist comes into the analysis.
Some of the directional forces in certain quadrants of the circle involved in using a spinner knob do not play well with the weaker directions of our wrist design.
And with general grip and hand strength compromised by ageing...
What we might have got away with in our brawny youth, we may injure ourselves, or fail to perform now, in a time of great exertion?
I have one that came on the old Massey Ferguson, don't really like it. It moves all around due to the fully hydraulic steering never returning to the same place twice...
My preference? I wouldn't use one on a road going vehicle.
happy coaching!
buswarrior
When I was a kid, they were referred as necker knobs.
I wouldn't drive our bus without one. My land cruiser has one too. Everyone who has ever borrowed our truck got so addicted to it they wanted one
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FYI, my steering wheel doesn't whip when I hit a curb etc. the power steering ram softens that. I off-road some insane stuff and have never ever had that happen. My 1946 farmall super M tractor had manual steering and it whipped all over messing up my wrist many times
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LOL I never had one on the bus but I bought John Deere knobs buy the box where people would steal them off the tractors,some people must love the things you have to have one a backhoe and loader.I never a piece of rubber tired equipment that did not come from the factory with one,then all I ever bought was Cat or John Deere too
had them on my tractors but not on the Bus. They are illegal in many states including Cali. I turned our wheel so that when I steer one hand left is on the wheel and the other is at 5 oclock with split fingers over spoke and wheel. Just more comfortable.
Dave
For those of you saying they're not legal... often that's a myth. Check your state.
http://www.suicideknob.net/state_laws.html (http://www.suicideknob.net/state_laws.html)
This is the kind of off-roading I do with a spinner. Never once had an issue.(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fuploads.tapatalk-cdn.com%2F20161202%2F4ba1a9c9663a8576cc631e847edbaa0b.jpg&hash=0f1faa70e208140fb5c59c5762923a1715959323)(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fuploads.tapatalk-cdn.com%2F20161202%2F4ff3f709775b7a6d9658fcbea4fc61f5.jpg&hash=8d9d124014abc90011372bc7f8346cf0aa176678)(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fuploads.tapatalk-cdn.com%2F20161202%2F1741d58401e87c6271b4744a2024155d.jpg&hash=7c0714127e5505560b27d255daf7631e87b2ece0)(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fuploads.tapatalk-cdn.com%2F20161202%2F475213ec23e6f47c116b46e65b66e331.jpg&hash=1bf3d116c1b3b7625fd573e0a0bc0da56fed6e51)
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We had these on the loaders I drove so it left one hand free to operate the bucket controls. Never really needed on in a bus. However if I decide to take up cigarette smoking, then I may have to get one for the bus too.
When we drove buses up the road to Sunshine Village Ski Area(Banff), in the seventies before the first gondola was built, we had one hand on the steering wheel (sometimes), the 2 way radio mic in the other, and also a cigarette, a coffee, a sandwich, a newspaper, and an eye in the interior rear view mirror checking out a hot bunny five rows back. And we didn't have no spinner knob either! That was before distracted driving was invented when cell phones came on...
JC
I put one on our first 24ft motorhome and really liked it. It had power steering, and I found the knob useful for maneuvering in tight spaces. The first bus did not have one. That had no power steering at first, and it would have been ridiculous to try turning the wheel with just one hand. Of course, it could have worked at road speeds, but I never found it useful for that. When we installed power steering on it, we just used a car pillar and wheel. The steering was easy enough and the wheel small enough that I could do just as well with the palm of my hand. I never even thought of installing a knob. Now on this bus, we have power assist steering. I never thought of putting one on. I guess I just do not see the need since I take my time maneuvering anyway.
For what it's worth, they are illegal in the UK unless you are registered disabled.
I have a Range Rover and big Jag, both with very power-assisted steering (like many US cars I guess), and I very often use the 'flat hand' technique to spin the steering wheel - which I feel bad about because it's surely dangerous given that you have no real grip on the steering wheel at all - in that circumstance having a steering wheel knob would perhaps be preferable, but I'm not sure I'd want one at any other time
Jeremy
You ever blow a steer tire, you'll wish you didn't have one.
Quote from: Tikvah on December 02, 2016, 12:40:07 PM
For those of you saying they're not legal... often that's a myth. Check your state.
http://www.suicideknob.net/state_laws.html (http://www.suicideknob.net/state_laws.html)
Spinner knobs are illegal in CA. I have read the vehicle code and it is definitely in there.
--Geoff
Everything is illegal in California except paying Taxes,LOL
Check Pa. Vehicle inspection regulations.
There is a friggn law against everything if you just spent the time to check lol makes me want spinner knob now
They ARE legal in Kalifornia--if you are missing an arm! Probably something we all should look into???
Which begs the question: is it safer to drive when you have 1 arm and use a spinner or have two arms and use a spinner. I have a couple of friends who are sadly paraplegic after ATV accidents and since they use hand controls to control the gas and brake, they have a spinner knob to help them steer with their free hand. One of those friends had a wicked modified corvette....let's just say he took me for a ride and had that thing sideways around a corner while accelerating and kept it all under impressive control. I will say if I blow a steer, that knob will be just one of many many worry's...so that's why I run brand new steers.
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Someone actually post the language in the law that specifically prohibits a spinner. I have read the laws from several states and some will say "no attachment on steering wheel or trim piece should be able to catch jewelry or clothing during normal driving maneuvers". During normal driving maneuvers I could prove in court that my spinner does not catch jewelry or my clothing. So that is a gray area for sure. Unless someone specifically can quote a state law indicating that a spinner is illegal then it's just hearsay. I have been pulled over several times with a spinner installed in my truck without a single mention of it ever. And I've had one in my cars for the past 7 years. I drive 45,000 miles a year so my statistical risk of either crashing or getting a ticket for my knob is three times the national average. So far I'm still alive and ticket free with the cleanest squeaky clean driving record. I've blown three tires too if that makes a difference.
To each their own. It's funny how we put the weight of risk on things without weighing the risks of other things. Some of you guys are comfortable driving after drinking a single beer. I have never had a drop of alcohol in my life and there is scientific proof that just one beer slows your reaction time a little. Some of you drive when you're a bit tired. I limit my road time to 6 hours a day max broken up by an hour long lunch. Heck, some of you chose to live in California...that just increased your risk of death 5 fold over living in rural Michigan ;-)
Risk vs reward. Life is full of calculated risks. If I really wanted to be really really safe, there's no way on earth I'd be driving a 38,000 lb hunk of steel around where I'm mere inches from the windshield with zero crumple zone. The risk is, I could lose my life or legs in even a relatively minor collision. The reward is that if I can manage not to crash, I get to have my family with me while on tour...versus not seeing them much for 6 months out of the year.
Now that I've publicly typed all this, I expect Karma (which I really don't believe in) to get me a ticket for one soon or crash because of one soon :-/
Sigh.
Maybe I'll permanently injure my arm in the accident and then I can legally and safely use a spinner at that point making this conversation moot. Where's Boxcar Okie?
have one on the John Deere would never have one one the street
Scott sorry to side track this in your direction as being illegal!
I was merely stating that the wonderful CHP DOT officer at the Banning, CA West Bound Scalehouse on I-10 gave me a ticket for having one.
It may be because it was a commercial vehicle, it may have been because I was a long haired redneck truck driver from Cuntucky in his great state of Kalifornication or it may have not been illegal at all and I might have paid a ticket for just being there.
I don't know if it was or wasn't really illegal or not. I do know I was glad that it was the only thing he could find to ticket me for and I was allowed to drive away on my own after "posting bond". (in other words pay now, and if you come to court and win, we'll refund the $! Well I didn't worry about coming back to court to claim my $48 bond!)
;D BK ;D
Quote from: Scott & Heather on December 02, 2016, 11:07:11 PM
Now that I've publicly typed all this, I expect Karma (which I really don't believe in) to get me a ticket for one soon or crash because of one soon :-/
I would not worry about Karma, it is just a psychological bug planted in your brain while it calculates right and wrong, reward and risk, etc. I would just consider how much it would smart if the Knuckle Buster hit your microphone holding hand. Hey, maybe the solution is to have two of them in the 10 & 2 o'clock positions. That way you have both hands on the wheel in the correct positions! ;D
We too had them on our tractors on the farm and these were all manual steer .Got to wondering once why there was not one on the Farmall M "tricycle" we had. Got one at the filling station(back then every station would would have a display board on their counter ) and put it on Big Red. Needless to say ,this was not the smartest move of my farming career .Went happily down through the field and all was well ---------until that front end caught a rut at the end of the row ,Makes my arm hurt just to think about it !!!!
Say what you will but I like how my chrome skull spinner would sit there rotating as if it were motorized atop my custom half wheel, your tickets (where ever they might be) don't frighten me.😎Just the cost of living free!
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Van is that the Belly wheel, lol ::)
Dave
Yuppers Dave 😉
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Yep this tri gear M's were made by international harvester. I grew up driving our 1946 model all the time. And yes I have scars from the steering wheel burning my wrist it spun so fast when hitting ruts. Loved that tractor.
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So my impression, the thought of a steering wheel spinning out of our hands is a manual steering problem. Yes, your old tractors (I drove one too) and the old manual steer busses. Yes, I've driven those too. I can't comprehend my power steering wheel pulling away from me, certainly not to the point of hurting my wrist.
If that were true, a blown tire would send the bus sideways across the median, flipping to its side and taking many innocent motorists with it. Ya, we've all seen the YouTube video, but I can't imagine that's a real daily risk we take.
A power steering system, like Scott has.. like I have, is easy to control, even in a rut, curb, blown tire, etc. A spinner knob on the steering wheel isn't going to smash my wrist. To the contrary, if the wheel wasn't firmly held, the spinner knob might be an asset by being easily "caught" by a unsuspected spin of the wheel. A quick correction of the wheel, by way of power steering, and the potential accident avoided.
Am I out to lunch?