Hello to my fellow bus nuts! I haven't been on the forum in a couple months because I have been in my bus! LOL. My 4107 is setup an an entertainer coach because I'm a Christian singer, and boy are we blessed with a busy schedule right now... I was on I-20 last week, and "Gracie" shut off on us. We pulled over, and she was smoking pretty good. Antifreeze all over the hood, we filled her back up with water, let her cool down and started her back up and moved her about 100 yards so we could get a truck hooked up to our equipment trailer. Needless to say, it was an interesting day since we had a show to get to.
Gracie was towed to Columbia, SC to a shop that knows Detroit engines. They are suppose to tear the motor out this week and let me know what our next steps are. They tell me worse case senario is to put in another motor, which will have to be shipped in from Germany? They said this would be pretty costly. If that is the case, I will have to weigh out paying for the expense of the new motor and installation vs shopping for another coach. My original plan was to eventually move to a prevost and sell my 4107, this may end up happening before I had planned.
So why am I writing this to you guys? Well... we love Gracie, she is a beauty and home on the road to us. She has been so good to us. For those of you that are believers, asking for prayer :-) And also, wanted some advice if I begin to shop for prevosts? I've been eyeing the XLs... I've been told to aim for the 60 series engine because almost anyone can work on it? Not really sure what type of mileage these run? I'm just looking around, trying to get a grasp on how to judge the worth of them based on their features, mileage, year, etc... so any advice you may have I would love to hear.
Thanks for your input. The forum has been such a blessing to me as I have learned how to become a bus nut. I love it! Thanks guys! :-)
If they are telling you that they would have to ship another engine in from Germany, the first thing you need to do is find another shop. Don't let them touch it, you will be sorry.
REALLY..why would they say Germany.... what shop...what city ?
well, I kinda of thought the same thing LOL. I've been looking around online for rebuilt 8v71s. The germany thing was just something mentioned by one of the employees, may not be the real case. The company in general has a very good reputation. I've done some research on them. Some truck drivers that I know have spoke highly of them when it comes to working on Detroits. The thing I keep hearing is... "they are high, but they are good"...
For now, I'm just waiting on them to give me a diagnosis, then I can start making some decisions. Thanks for your input.
Hi Bryan,
Was there any preliminary diagnosis? Something must have told them they had to take the engine out to diagnose the issue. Do you mind sharing the name of the shop? Someone here may know someone there...
Kind Regards and in Him, Phil
http://www.ebay.com/itm/8V-71-Detroit-Diesel-engine-Allison-V-730-transmission-cradle-for-GM-RTS-Bus-/201378626695?hash=item2ee319fc87&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/8V-71-Detroit-Diesel-engine-Allison-V-730-transmission-cradle-for-GM-RTS-Bus-/201378626695?hash=item2ee319fc87&vxp=mtr)
I Just did a quick ebay search and this popped up. Way less expensive of an option to put a new used engine in. Probably 90% less expensive.
Pretty obvious why the chap said germany, and it is the second worst scenario - MTU makes Detroit Diesel engines now and they are in Germany. Worst case scenario is buying a new 4107, I guess.
I guess if you are asking for advice, my advice is wait till you get the diagnosis. Only then can you start to make a decision. Your decision would be different than mine, since your bus is a business tool that you use to create your income (unless my conception of a Christian singer is wrong) so you need a reliable bus to get you to your place of business. In that case I would budget around $100K for a decent used Prevost Entertainer in current service (running ready to go) with a modern drivetrain and start looking around.
Good luck, in any event.
My choice of prevost pre 2001 but with 60 series. XLII had some de-laminate=the siding come loose/ issues on siding. Plus you are strapped with a egr engine costing several miles per gallon. Poor man's answer! Really nice XLII 's that have the 30,000$ dollar siding repair out there--beware! repair is good. The more documentation you can get the better as to what has been updated etc. My opinion only.. Any thing that disagree with my statement please feel free. Bob
Before you drop 30 grand on 8V71 rebuild look at your choices the pre EGR 12.7 series 60 can be found in the D model MCI buses at good buys.
About anything a shop does with repairs is going to be 5 grand plus and don't buy a used engine off Ebay even the so called rebuilds sold there are questionable with warranty work.
I know this for fact I have a 8v92 the guy was told it had only 50,000 miles it's a wore out piece of junk and he paid with a cash transfer(5000) + shipping to a guy in NY now he is SOL no recourse
Quote from: plyonsMC9 on July 20, 2015, 10:06:03 PM
Hi Bryan,
Was there any preliminary diagnosis? Something must have told them they had to take the engine out to diagnose the issue. Do you mind sharing the name of the shop? Someone here may know someone there...
Kind Regards and in Him, Phil
Hey Phil,
The name of the shop is WW Williams in East Columbia, SC. As far as a preliminary diagnosis, I'm not real sure. I've not spoke with an actual accountant, but rather the front office people.
Thanks for any help you may have. Blessings to you!
Quote from: luvrbus on July 21, 2015, 09:46:06 AM
Before you drop 30 grand on 8V71 rebuild look at your choices the pre EGR 12.7 series 60 can be found in the D model MCI buses at good buys.
About anything a shop does with repairs is going to be 5 grand plus and don't buy a used engine off Ebay even the so called rebuilds sold there are questionable with warranty work.
I know this for fact I have a 8v92 the guy was told it had only 50,000 miles it's a wore out piece of junk and he paid with a cash transfer(5000) + shipping to a guy in NY now he is SOL no recourse
the pre EGR 12.7 series 60 you are referring to. Are you saying I can buy those new? And they will bolt right up?
No, he is saying if you decide to dump the GM that engine is a good one and can be found in a MCI D model bus, should you decide to look for a new bus. It won't go in a GM.
Brian
Quote from: robertglines1 on July 21, 2015, 05:50:39 AM
My choice of prevost pre 2001 but with 60 series. XLII had some de-laminate=the siding come loose/ issues on siding. Plus you are strapped with a egr engine costing several miles per gallon. Poor man's answer! Really nice XLII 's that have the 30,000$ dollar siding repair out there--beware! repair is good. The more documentation you can get the better as to what has been updated etc. My opinion only.. Any thing that disagree with my statement please feel free. Bob
Hey Bob, curious to know why pre 2001? is that when they started the XLII?
Quote from: Scott Crosby on July 21, 2015, 01:32:18 AM
http://www.ebay.com/itm/8V-71-Detroit-Diesel-engine-Allison-V-730-transmission-cradle-for-GM-RTS-Bus-/201378626695?hash=item2ee319fc87&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/8V-71-Detroit-Diesel-engine-Allison-V-730-transmission-cradle-for-GM-RTS-Bus-/201378626695?hash=item2ee319fc87&vxp=mtr)
I Just did a quick ebay search and this popped up. Way less expensive of an option to put a new used engine in. Probably 90% less expensive.
Somebody really put a lot of effort into wanting to sell that. Is it that hard to take good pictures of something that is a "good deal"??
Has any diagnoses been done? Could be a simple cooling system component failure.
They are removing engine today and tomorrow. Supposed to hear back from them tomorrow evening with a diagnosis.
Quote from: Bryan on July 21, 2015, 06:09:40 PM
They are removing engine today and tomorrow. Supposed to hear back from them tomorrow evening with a diagnosis.
I am at a loss here... certainly the shop should have atleast told you why they are pulling the motor....any competent shop should have a clue as to why they are pulling the motor...
There are a lot of things they can see/determine with the motor still in the chassis...but they have told you nothing ?
well I'm at a little bit of a loss too, I'm not a mechanic... learning as I go. It's tough with these diesel shops because you don't always know who to trust. On the flip side, thru traveling in this bus a lot and landing at different shops with different issues, I've been blessed over and over again with great people. Sometimes even leaving shops with no bill. I have some incredible stories. Again, I'm a singer, not a mechanic, but God has always been in the mist. I will be sure to update this thread as I know more info, and I'm very thankful for all of your input. You BUS NUTS are great! :-)
I am with Don. Did they let you know how much to take it out and to put it back in if you decide not to have them do it there? Once it is out they know it is easier for them to have you over a barrel so to speak....
They should of said we need to take it out and the cost for that in writing would be and for the reason of we have to check this or that and cannot get to it unless we do. And then if you decide to get a second opinion it will also cost this much to put it back. Here's the estimate shall we go ahead? Just saying!...
Not saying they aren't good. They are not a small company and have shops in a lot of places and they probably buy their parts from big companies and are in it to make a profit and pay all their expenses.
Lol it is easier on a GM to do about anything by removing the engine,the 2 piece oil pan is a PITA for 1
Quote from: luvrbus on July 22, 2015, 08:05:07 AM
Lol it is easier on a GM to do about anything by removing the engine,the 2 piece oil pan is a PITA for 1
that may be... but if 3 guys can drop a pan and replace a liner in a parking lot in North Dakota in the dark with a flash lite ....seems like Williams could too... ;D
Different model of GM bus and engine too Donald,they probably know something happen on the upper side it always does and that head and pan is a bitch to remove in the 4106 and forward easier to remove the engine.
Quote from: luvrbus on July 22, 2015, 08:18:19 AM
Different model of GM bus and engine too Donald,they probably know something happen on the upper side it always does and that head and pan is a bitch to remove in the 4106 and forward easier to remove the engine.
Agreed...just baffles me why they would say nothing.... BUT often a person/owner will be at the service desk and say ...well just do what needs to be done.... not thinking that this is gonna hurt... A LOT !! ;D ;D
If a person knows what he is doing and has a good fork lift ,pulling a motor is not a big deal.Worked for a bus company back in the 70ties .They had a couple of shall we say over indulgent in the spirits kind of mechanic's. They could have a motor sitting in the cradle with in two hour's.I too ,don't like the idea of not having some kind of idea about what I'm getting into until they tear the motor down .That could come up with a 5000 dollar bill for nothing if you decided not to have the work done.As for finding a newer bus with a series 60 engine,I can tell you and if you have been on this site for some time ,you know this is true ,the Two Strokes have as many fans if not more ,than the series 60's do.Being a gospel singer ,I'm sure you know who Steve Weatherford is .Look his site up some time .He is one of the biggest "bus nut's" you have ever seen
!!!
They can pull the engine and remove the upper head a hella lot faster than trying to remove the head with the engine in the bus 90% of the time when a GM gets hot and shuts downs the upper head is cracked.It is going to cost to him some $$$$$ it is not the same as checking out a T drive IMO
Bigred Steve loves his new cummins, knows the days of the 2 strokes are nearing their end, and yes he's a smart man
It would indeed take a smart man to put a series 60 and an automatic transmission in a 3751!!! He did and I think he told me he sold it to some Holly Wood Producer that still drives the thing up and down Route 66 .I am with him!! I love the Cummins engines also .I have an 8.3 in an old motor home that I have .As Wendy Bagwell used to say ,this is the truth with my hand up,I can go out in the dead of winter and not even wait on the preheater and that engine won't turn two full turns until it starts.One of the pet peeves I have with my 8v92 is cold weather starting.Unless i keep it plugged in ,I have to run the generator and the engine heater for up to two hours depending on just how cold it is .
Bryan, I have never been to their Columbia shop but the WW Williams shop in Greer, SC is a well thought of shop that knows their Detroits. With that said, they are not cheap. If the engine is toast I do not know if Williams will want to install a used engine, thus the comments about the cost of a new one. I would say they mostly deal with national accounts that do not flinch at a $30,000 bill. You do not see a lot of vintage busses in their shop. I would want some detailed cost figures before I turned them loose on my bus. It may be a lot cheaper to tow it someplace else.
Good luck and keep us posted.
If Williams doesn't work out for you ,check for a Clarke Power Service Center in Columbia .If they have a full service facility ,they are great.Don't fool with any of their regional people though .I went that route and it cost me a pile of money for nothing.They are strong on Detroit's at their major facility's.They told me at Greensboro that they rebuild these things all the time because trucking company's had rather rebuild these old engines than to buy new equipment with the DEF and all this other computerized stuff. How ever I hope you got good news today from Williams .
Just Curious Bryan.What did Williams tell you on your coach?????
Guess ole Bryan must have died when he got that price from Williams huh???
He is probably just catching his breath
I think he should drag it to NC to either Davids Coach repair or Russells Diesel.
Then it would be fixed right and not rip him off.
Ask Boomer he came from Washington to get his fixed right.
uncle ned
Just for future reference Uncle Ned ,where is Davids Coach located? I have Gene Russel's phone number in Mill Spring's.
Davids Coach is located on hy 18 between Shelby and Morganton.
828 874-6105
The cleanest shop I have ever seen.
My first trip to him he asked if it was alright if he steam cleaned the engine before working on it.
great guy
uncle ned
Can't blame him for wanting to steam clean a Detroit before he works on it!!! Thanks a lot Uncle Ned.He is within 60 miles or so of where I live.
Hey guys! Thanks for checking on me. You are correct that I had to take a deep breath after I got my estimate. 2 heads were cracked. They are saying they have to get the parts from Germany. I haven't moved forward with it yet because I'm still trying to figure out what to do. As of right now I owe 1,200 for the engine take out and diagnosis. But here is what it's going to cost to fix.
$14,000 for parts, $5,500 for labor
Everyone I have spoke with speaks highly of this shop but that they are expensive. If I tow it to another shop I will have towing expense and loose the 1,200 (which by the way will be credited to my total if they fix it).
In the meantime I've kept my ears open for other buses and have found a 92 Prevost Le mirage with 8v92 for $45,000. Interior and exterior in amazing shape. It's very nice. They tell me the motor is in great shape too, but how do you really know? 250,000 miles. From what I've seen, that seems to be a pretty good deal? Right?
Right now I'm trying trying to be patient and figure out what I need to do. I enjoy hearing your advice.
Thanks again!
Ask if you can buy your heads then you buy a rebuilt set,Williams stopped using rebuilt heads and fwiw a bare head with nothing are over 3 grand each from MTU.
I know they won't warranty the engine with rebuilt heads from a out source so it is catch 22 for you but will save you 5 grand and all the DD heads are cast in Mexico now
If you have the finances, go for the Prevost. The older buses feel like a money pit. The newer ones, at least you don't feel like you are dumping money into a huge time bomb.
Just my opinion ;D
Bryan: everyone wants a bus as new as possible,but here is the deal.Looks like Williams will repair your bus for around 24,000 buy the time you pay shipping and taxes .The coach you are looking at ,probably can be bought for 40 or 42 thousand .Now comes crunch time .If you choose not to have yours repaired ,you are out $1200.00 for labor plus towing charges.If you have it moved again ,there goes another two grand plus you are saddled with a non mobile coach that you are going to have to do something with .You might get lucky and find someone to give it to ,but here is the deal.U R going to be out close to 50,000 dollars and getting a coach that u know very little or nothing about.If your bus is in good condition and you have kept up the maintenance ,I think I would go ahead and have the Buffalo fixed .A lot of money but a lot less heart aches and they will give you a guaranty .I don't know if you are making enough from your singing ministry to report your earnings ,but if u r then u can write off the repair on a pro-rated basis .Just my thought's 4 what it's worth!!
For that kind of money, I'd want a complete rebuild, not just new heads. If you got it hot enough to crack the heads, you may have scored the cylinders too. Now that you know about the other outfit, talk with them for price of doing the same job.
Thanks for all of your input. I think they are doing a complete rebuild. I'm attaching a pic of the parts they are replacing/rebuilding. Maybe it will give a deeper insight.
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.tapatalk-cdn.com%2F15%2F07%2F30%2F7c904494f80023959cdb412799c9bb0f.jpg&hash=1a4f1e1f05b986b78aa5e7e1695892d0bb2733b8)
Also what kind of warranty should they be giving me?
They will give you 90 days on labor and 1 year on parts it look like they have the parts covered
I will sell you my bus for less than that and you can drive it or put the motor in yours.
So this looks like a complete rebuild correct?
Bryan check Craig's List, Atlanta Ga. saw an ad posted Detroit engines for sale at a bus shop, owner retiring in Meriweather County. Don't know if it is still listed but worth a look .
Thanks! I've actually found a couple used engines but isn't that kind of taking a chance?
Bryan nothing wrong with a used engine if it is a good one. I would want to hear it run with a working oil pressure gauge,water hose or radiator hooked up,fire it up and let it get to operating temp.then full power and see what happens. If it is a good engine and the owner trusts that is a good eng ,they won't mind you testing it. Also take someone with you that knows the difference between a good and bad eng. If you have oil pressure within spects. hot/cold,not putting air bubbles in radiator or heads(cracked heads etc),not leaking a lot of oil,then it may be a good eng. Your engine was a used one before it broke ! lol ! If your eng was good, buy a used engine or heads,take the heads and have them checked,rebuilt etc put on your engine and ride on down the road, Running you will have something to sale or trade on another coach. Bryan it's your money so how you spend it is your choice,just different ways to do it,lol Glen
Sounds like they are no more expensive than anyone else .!!!
Weigh your options do you want to spend 20 to 30 grand on a bus worth 15 grand maybe.
Me I would look for 93 or 94 Prevost,MCI or yea even a Van Hool entertainer bus with a 12.7 series 60 and B500 transmission.
I saw a outfit auction off 10- 93-94 models H series with the 11.1 series 60 they brought nothing 12 to 14 grand each fwiw the one that sold for 14 grand was a day coach setup real nice bus,
There was 3 -2002 seated Prevost XLll in Dallas for sale the guy was asking 35 grand ea but would take less they were hi mileage but good buses.Prevo guys don't like to hear it but watch out for rust on anything pre 1986 they can rust with the best (Eagle) ;D
Checkout Jim's site www.busesonline.com (http://www.busesonline.com) you never know what pops up there and don't be afraid to make a offer you never know
Yea it's definitely a tough decision. It's real hard for me to let the 4107 go, she is real nice inside and the rebuilt transmission only has 10,000 miles on it. Generator has less than 1,000 hours, kubota.
I'm heading to Jims site now. I've been browsing lots of sites and haven't found any deals like I'm seeing on this 92 prevost I'm looking at so far.
Thanks for the input guys!
Oh and one other thing... When you guys are going to look at a potential bus you may purchase, would you just take a mechanic with you? Do an oil test? Etc? What are your recommendations on that?
Oil sample for sure!
It's a tough place to be. It is very likely that if you upgrade to a Prevost, you will be happy with it. But if you put the money into the old bus, you may end up second guessing the decision for years to come. Possibly you could get something out of it by selling parts like the newish transmission. You could also look to see if there is a good Wanderlodge or Newell around for a good price.
If you can find something that is not far from where you are, perhaps the shop will credit part of what you paid them to go through the new prospect.
I was just looking here at used engines: http://www.adelmans.com/detroit?&page=1&perpage=18 (http://www.adelmans.com/detroit?&page=1&perpage=18)
Good site and info. At those prices would make me take a look if they would fit in the bus.
They sell the engines at core prices and believe me after buying a transmission and a 8V92 from Adelmans I wouldn't buy another one.
I was told the engine had been started and checked for smoking and oil pressure it could have started maybe 20 years back
Bryan, keep in mind that the 92 Prevost you are looking at has 23 year old used engine in it if it is the original engine.
This is all true plus the fact that the Prevost's are not problem free by any means.I can personally testify to that.
Bryan, in addition to looking at Jim Michaud's site, I'd suggest you give him a phone call. Both Jim, and his father Spike have the knack of finding things -- if they don't already know where there's a hidden cache. When I bought our 4107 from Spike, he sourced a radiator fan from somewhere in the Carolinas.
Arthur
I would be concerned that any other used bus you buy could need a rebuild of engine/trans/rear end at anytime. If you find a real beauty with documented rebuild of engine and transmission in recent history at a good price, anything else and you are gambling. In your position I would get either a rebuild oxr drop in a rebuild. Unless you do beaucoup beaucoup miles a year you should be okay for awhile. Just my way, I have never had good luck putting in used parts. And to me you have a rig you know. One caveat is that I know there are some real garage queens out there, where good mechanics spent many years rebuilding everything until they were too old to keep going. Those buses will often sell for much less than they are worth.
Thanks guys! The adelmans site definitely has some cheap prices in comparison to what I would be paying for the rebuild. I'm wondering why type of guarantees come with these.
It seems that half of you would never buy a used engine, and half of you would, LOL! I'm still over here trying to make decisions.
I'm thinking of making the drive on Thursday to look at the Prevost. I already have seen many pics, I know it's nice, just after going thru this motor stuff, just want to make sure this motor is well taken care of, it has 212,000 miles. I've never done an oil test, so when I go look at the bus, I should just get some oil from the bus and take it with me? How does all of that work? I would appreciate any detailed advice on that LOL. Thanks!
[Check your messages. ]
http://blackstone-labs.com (http://blackstone-labs.com)
For oil sample containers.
Bryan,
100% go look at that prevost. I'm guessing you can still order parts for that Prevost. When you are on a schedule, that is SO helpful. BTDT. Most people on here don't know what it is like to tour and have to be somewhere at a certain time. IMHO, the newer the better.
Have fun!
John
Remember, any used engine needs to be left hand rotation. Unless your current coach is perfect for your needs for the next 15 years, go for the Prevost if you can swing it. You'll never regret it down the road.Yesthe Prevost is older, but the GMC is no spring chicken. Parts are going to be more difficult to obtain as time goes on and not just engine parts.
Quote from: John316 on August 03, 2015, 11:46:23 AM
Bryan,
100% go look at that prevost. I'm guessing you can still order parts for that Prevost. When you are on a schedule, that is SO helpful. BTDT. Most people on here don't know what it is like to tour and have to be somewhere at a certain time. IMHO, the newer the better.
Have fun!
John
Thanks John, Looks like you know a little bit about touring road life! Right now we are having to pull our big equipment trailer with a truck, had 4 gigs just this week. We are very much ready to get back in a bus :-) The day we broke down, we were only an hour from the church... thank God someone was able to come pick us up with the trailer and get us there on time to setup. As I was singing, I was thinking about "Gracie" hanging out on the side of the interstate :-)
Quote from: John316 on August 03, 2015, 11:46:23 AM
When you are on a schedule, that is SO helpful. BTDT. Most people on here don't know what it is like to tour and have to be somewhere at a certain time. IMHO, the newer the better.
This is exactly why we bought a new Freightliner and had it converted for our music ministry. You need dependable transportation when on a schedule! Since we are not on the road as much now we can relax!!
Site is here: http://www.ustruckin.blogspot.com/ (http://www.ustruckin.blogspot.com/)
Keep on singing the Gospel and keep on busin.
GaryD
Try to get a bus with a series 60 in it if you can swing it
Bryan,
We mostly quit the road gig about a year ago. If we had it to do over again, I would get a toterhome, like Gary's, in a heartbeat.
I can't imagine what it would be like to break down on the road, then have to try to source a part from some obscure place. Not my idea of fun.
Lord provided for you, since you were so close to the church. When we lost our tranny, we were several hours out, but had a day padding. A rental truck later, we were back on the road. Good times ;D
God bless,
John
You asked about how to get an oil check up done. The two that I have had worked this way. I bought a little plastic bottle from WW Williams in Greer, SC. (I am sure you can get them else where) The purchase price included lab work. I drained a little oil in it and sent it to the lab address on the bottle. In a week or so they mailed me the results.
How and from where did you drain a 'little' oil from?
Cat dealers sell sampling kit fwiw sampling does no good on clean oil so if the oil has been changed it's a waste.
I take a sample on the transmission,power steering,differential,cooling system and the hubs also, if all the oil is nice and new you can bank on someone is hiding something
Quote from: digesterman on August 03, 2015, 06:35:43 PM
How and from where did you drain a 'little' oil from?
I caught the oil in it when I was changing the oil.
😀 Charles I had that one down but was always curious how a person could pull a sample without an oil change, maybe a tube down the dipstick would be the easiest
Quote from: digesterman on August 04, 2015, 06:11:26 PM
😀 Charles I had that one down but was always curious how a person could pull a sample without an oil change, maybe a tube down the dipstick would be the easiest
That is the way they are done Lee my Cat sampling kit has a pump you screw a new jar on, stick the tube down the dip stick pump the jar full screw the cap on label it send it off. fwiw all my Cat equipment had sampling ports you just open a valve and filled the jar
Some have installed one of these:
http://www.amazon.com/Fumoto-F-106N-Engine-Drain-Valve/dp/B003T7XUE4 (http://www.amazon.com/Fumoto-F-106N-Engine-Drain-Valve/dp/B003T7XUE4)
I know that it is easiest to do at an oil change, but it can be done anytime. There really is not any pressure when you remove your drain plug, so you can loosen the plug and switch the valve in quickly without much of a leak. I did that once, so it is not just a theory. You could, of course, collect some oil that way, but I would think that you want the oil to be well circulated, and I would not try this with hot oil.
Cat taught me only take samples after everything is at operating temperatures I have never taken a cold oil sample
Did you mean Dallas?
Bryan,
And this is why I love newer equipment, if you are on a schedule. http://www.busconversions.com/bbs/index.php?topic=29528.0 (http://www.busconversions.com/bbs/index.php?topic=29528.0)
What did you think of that Prevost?
Thanks,
John
Quote from: John316 on August 05, 2015, 02:32:24 PM
Bryan,
And this is why I love newer equipment, if you are on a schedule. http://www.busconversions.com/bbs/index.php?topic=29528.0 (http://www.busconversions.com/bbs/index.php?topic=29528.0)
What did you think of that Prevost?
Thanks,
John
I finally made the drive to look at the prevost yesterday. It seemed to be in great condition for it's age (1992)... it has the 8v92, which I've been thinking I need to wait on a 60 series, I just know I may have to pay more for one of those. I feel like this one is good deal. I haven't totally made my mind up, but because of the motor, and also we would need to do a little remodeling to be able to sleep a couple more people, I may just need to be patient and wait. This opens up a new question... where do you guys recommend me looking for Prevosts for sale?
This would be my ideal setup... Prevost, 60 series, 5 or 6 bunks, rear bedroom, shower, front room kitchen, dinette, couches, chairs, etc.
Thanks!
Sounds like an entertainer would be a good deal of the way there. They are often cheaper than a completed conversion but may have a lot of miles.
You need the history on series 60 those are not bullet proof engines all the hype about it being a 1,000,000 mile engine doesn't happen in a bus.
I have mine tore down changing the bull gear a weak leak on those engines,I could not find any history where it was ever changed so I would rather be safe than sorry when one turns loose it's a 25,000 + bill to repair
If the 60 series has ever been to a DD dealer they have a record so check and check,I found a lot of records on mine like where the head was replaced and 3 turbos along with a lot of other items.
Drive it to a DD dealer if any work was ever done at a DD dealer they can tell you the dates and problems and if all the updates were done.I would not take a salesperson word on the condition of the engine JMW do your home work there is nothing like buying a patch job series 60
Bryan if you are thinking about buying I saw this bus about a year ago is Stephens Co. Ga. It is a 40/45 ft. Eagle entertainer bus,7 or 9 bunks lounge in rear,zoned heat and cool,large diesel generator,8v-92 recent in-frame or rebuild,good looking bus. I wish I could remember more about it but it's been several months but he called me last week and left a message said he thinks he may sell. If you are interested send me a pm and I'll give you his number.
Bryan:Sounds like you are looking for a 94 or 95 model .Since these are the first years for the series 60 ,I really think that one of the later 8v92's might be a better choice.Just my 2 cents! I still think that if you are happy with the Buffalo ,I think I wold opt for the rebuild!!
94-95 model Prevost can have the 11.1 series 60 be sure you buy a 12.7 series 60 better engine than a 11.1 with better fuel mileage IMO
Any update did he buy or rebuild I hate it when this S*** happens
hey guys! Just wanted to give you an update. I have decided to move forward with the rebuild. The parts are in, and waiting on cylinder kits to get here tomorrow. They are telling me I should have her in a week. I'm very excited about having her back as we have missed her on the road.
On another note, I'm still keeping my eyes open for a Prevost with a 60 series. Any suggestions on good places to look? Thank everybody for their support and encouragement!
I think that is a smart move Bryan! Well ,smart or not ,it is what I would have done!!
yea it was a tough decision, but I feel at peace about it. It was the right one I believe :-)
Old buses are like wife's when you get one you like you pay the maintenance and go forward ;D
This way you don't have a 42000 pound boat anchor to try and figure out how to get rid of!! lol
Maybe there is also something of "the devil you know versus the one you don't" to consider in the decision.
hey guys, here with another update, and a bit frustrated, maybe you guys can help me out...
Last year, when my manual transmission had a lot of issues, and after having it worked on multiple times, I bit the bullet to install an automatic. It's been great, except sometimes when we park close to the interstate, it takes about 5 miles to shift to 3rd? I've heard that is somewhat normal...
Well, I had told WW Williams to check this out once they got the motor rebuilt. The motor has now been rebuilt and was test drove today. Motor is doing great! But they mentioned that there was no modulator installed to tell the transmission when to change gears, I guess changes based on air/hydrolics? (I don't know)... but they told me if I didn't have a modulator that I could be looking at transmission damage in the future???
Because I'm supposed to have a warranty with my transmission, I plan on calling the shop on Monday to see why they didn't install a modulator? In the meantime, WW Williams is finding a price on one.
What do you guys think about all of this? Thanks for your input. Blessings!
listen to Williams...
the missing modulator is the fault of the installer, not the rebuilder/vendor...
are modulators easy to find? hard to put on? expensive?
Quote from: Bryan on September 04, 2015, 02:58:21 PM
are modulators easy to find? hard to put on? expensive?
yes,no,no...
What transmission do you have?
730
If this is it, looks like bargain to me. I'm only familiar with the 643.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Allison-V730-V731-V732-Transmission-Modulator-Signal-Valve-29504000-/301384336301?hash=item462be803ad&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Allison-V730-V731-V732-Transmission-Modulator-Signal-Valve-29504000-/301384336301?hash=item462be803ad&vxp=mtr)
thanks Opus!
Better have someone confirm that first. I was looking to see if it was the same as mine....and found that. ;)
.ebay.com/itm/Allison-V730-V731-V732-Transmission-Modulator-Signal-Valve-29504000-/301384336301?hash=item462be803ad&vxp=mtr[/url]
That is not the modulator the modulator mounts outside the transmission either cable controlled or air controlled google Williams Transmission modulator the air controlled model will pop up
So would it be this?: http://www.finditparts.com/products/563110/williams-valves-117830?srcid=CHL01SCL010-Npla-Dmdt-Gusa-Svbr-Mmuu-K563110&gclid=CjwKEAjwgqWvBRC2kajZjqeOn0oSJADqBi-lMHYDjXxD2QubwhdNQRvC2cd48QBIk6JSP-I66rU5shoCWJjw_wcB (http://www.finditparts.com/products/563110/williams-valves-117830?srcid=CHL01SCL010-Npla-Dmdt-Gusa-Svbr-Mmuu-K563110&gclid=CjwKEAjwgqWvBRC2kajZjqeOn0oSJADqBi-lMHYDjXxD2QubwhdNQRvC2cd48QBIk6JSP-I66rU5shoCWJjw_wcB)
Thats what I have on my 643.
That is the modulator for a Allison with a Williams air throttle goes on the out side held in by a clip and 5/16 bolt has a air line from a tee from the throttle
If he doesn't have a air throttle he needs the cable operated type from the throttle, push or pull type what ever will work for him lol if I could post photos here I could show you one,Google for Morse transmission modulators (310821) it will pop up with the cable the one to use with out the Williams throttle
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn2.bigcommerce.com%2Fn-biq04i%2Fr5ih0%2Fproducts%2F280%2Fimages%2F1103%2Fmodulator__51138.1392063008.1280.1280.jpg%3Fc%3D2&hash=d601cadc2e9ea6380b6a58ee70e98c94ed3f0d1a)
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.teleflex.com.au%2Fuserfiles%2FModulatorCableDia1.gif&hash=e7fe414e8d2a20f9035f2809c037b860026143dc)
v730 pneumatic throttle modulator
You see electric modulators on the Allison also fwiw a Allison will shift without a modulator you just need to do in manually with the shift selector or let the governor do it