I have been doing some research on jakes . I am trying to find out worth the money or not ? The mtns around here are no problem. We do have some high grades 15% but there not miles long . I am planning on out west travels and have some concerns . Should I have them and is it worth the investment on an 8v71.Or just be careful and not be so concerned ? Thanx for all the advice so far!
;D this will get you 101 answers
I bought my 4104 in Phoenix and came back to St. Louis via the Rocky mountains. I have a 6v92, with a 5 speed automatic transmission. I was going up and down 10,000 foot passes without my jakes working. I just downshifted to slow down 95% of the time, with no problems other than the line of angry cars behind me. ::)
just brought the bus home from Idyllwild CA today with a total of about a 7000 ft descent. I kept thinking over and over again how wonderful Jakes are. If the question is can you do without them, yes you can. You can do without lots of great things like air conditioning, heat, internet, auto transmissions, teeth, and several fingers and toes, so also you can do without auxiliary braking. However, if the question is whether they will vastly increase safety and make your drive far less stressful, then you should get them. Do truckers do without auxiliary braking? I wonder why that is!
Truckers are at 80,000 lbs and have a 4 stroke engine and most are built into the engine from the factory and work with the transmission they are not driving a 30,000 bus with a 2 stroke and paying some one 2500 bucks to install Jakes on a old engine that ran across the US before Jakes were even around I have plenty if he needs a set :o Most buses use a retarder transmission not Jakes
That's why I mentioned auxiliary braking instead of exclusively Jakes. Anyway, as I understand it, before Jakes you would just pull on the reins and yell, "Whooo"!
Try going off Sylvan Pass in Yellowstone or White Bird in Idaho with a 60 year old bus with worn and mal adjusted brakes and inexperienced driver. You may change your mind about wanting jakes.
Jakes are alright but not necessary on the light weight 35 ft buses all he needs to remember is come down in the same gear he used to get there and spend the money on fuel
My Eagle was heavy and 40 ft with 2 stage Jakes very seldom I ever used the Jakes unless I wanted to hear the sound in a tunnel or walled pass and we were all over the country it's his choice not mine if he would feel more secure I say go for it
None of the early L 10 Cummins in buses or trucks had Jakes they were not made for the early L10. Cummins did not want Jake's they would bend the rods
LOL just read your post Mark with those problems one has no business being on Sylvan Pass it is a little steep but I done it in my MCI 5 with no Jake brakes and a 644 Allison of all things with no lock up in 1st and 2nd it was a lot easier in the Trek with the 6.5 and no Jakes this summer ::)
Pick a pass pick a grade, Alaska, the Yukon Territory, Northwest Territory, British Columbia, Idaho, The Tetons, Yosemite to Lee Vining,Utah and many more...with an Allison.and a 5000lb trailer with no brakes hooked up.
And own a set of jakes... they're in a box, wrapped in oily rags.
I keep my brakes in very good condition.
I would not hesitate to do it again.
Wanna buy some jakes ;D
Seriously with a standard gear box they are not needed IMO.
Do like Harly..slow down and see the sights massage the brakes and stay sensible.
97 answers to go...
PS I use Delo 100 and Rotella oil :)
I find them useful, but I have an automatic trans with no retarder. Rolling on down the hill, grab 2nd in the 730 and flip on the jakes sure helps reduce the pucker factor.
OK, I probably don't NEED JAKE BRAKES!!! and I WANT THEM.
But---I have a fear of heights that makes driving in the mountains challenging even in my car. Yes--it is illogical--and sometimes not controllable. Took the wife and kids to the Grand Canyon, and Hoover Dam--but I couldn't get near the edge! Yes, I also DID NOT go over the "new" Pat Tillman memorial bridge. Instead I backtracked and took 95 down to Laughlin/Bullhead City, and across OLD RT 66 through Oatman to get to I40 East.
Somehow though, I ride comfortably in Huey's, Chinooks with the doors open over mountainous terrain without fear, and C-130s, C-17's, and all sorts of commercial jets also devoid of fear.
I think it has something to do with how secure I feel with the equipment I am in, and probably one of the main factors I don't trust is ME! I do feel significantly more secure with good equipment in good condition. More safety equipment decreases my fear, hopefully to a managable level so I can at least do the Interstate routes that have mountains. I don't have too much trouble here in the east, but I want to travel west.
So for me --I will have JAKES!!
If you can not think of any other reason, just the life extension of the brake parts, shoes, drums and feeling of security would be enough for me.
Had the Jakes on the 8V 12V-71 NS RGW 8v-92, worked great.
Today new store bought has the Meritor Discs and Allison Retarder on the 4000R, prefer the retarder, but the Jake is good too.
with the Disks & retarder, at 112,000 miles and with paying attention to the calipers being free, pads & rotors all look like new, mainly doe to my normally using the retarder for everything but stopping.
Dave M
I'll be completely honest - where I use my jake brakes most is in first and second gear stop and go traffic. Makes it real easy to control speed. I almost never use them on hills, only if I think of it and switch them on. I prefer to roll down the hill as far as possible and save on fuel. I like them, but I'm not positive I would pay for them. This is "Interstate" driving with 6% grades that are medium long, usually towing something.
Brian
I have used Jakes for 30 years on my bus and wouldn't be without them. I leave them turned on all the time and if I want to coast I just hold an 1/8" of the pedal on and they don't engage. Very seldom have to adjust the brakes using the Jakes so the cost saving on linings pays for them.
Steve I know exactly how you feel, jakes AND a tranny retarder isn't enough sometimes.
Followed my GPS two days ago and ended up on old hwy 49 driving between Placerville and Auburn Ca, in my 45' coach, all the brakes in the world wouldn't have helped me much considering this "hwy", and I use the term loosely, was evidently made originally for sure footed pack burros and hasn't been improved in the last 150 years.
Steve I know exactly how you feel, jakes AND a tranny retarder isn't enough sometimes.
Followed my GPS two days ago and ended up on old hwy 49 driving between Placerville and Auburn Ca, in my 45' coach, all the brakes in the world wouldn't have helped me much considering this "hwy", and I use the term loosely, was evidently made originally for sure footed pack burros and hasn't been improved in the last 150 years.
Sorry for double post, can't delete it on tapatalk I guess.
? did a GM ever have have Jake's from the factory I installed a few on GM but the owners have to butcher the tail gate I won't do it but they love their Jake's and will cut the tail gate for the Jake's and if they want 2 stage brake they run the wire for it I don't like wasting wire ::)
Eagles are a pain also till you get into the late 80's the passengers side is a real PITA you see the older Eagles with Jake's on the drivers side only if they make you feel safer go for it
The problem with Jake's on a 2 stroke is oil pressure one has to keep the rpm up for Jake's to work,then if you have the 740 it free wheels in 1st gear and the 600 series they free wheel in 1st and 2nd gear,then you start looking for a converter lock up valve for the transmissions another 4 or 5 hundred bucks uys
Some fool with the adjustment Don Fairchild my good friend says it helps I set the the Jake's with the Jake gauge
Just for the hell of it I priced out a new set of Jake's from WW.William for a 8V Detroit for you guys 7600 bucks less installation and wiring LOL I still remember back 10 or 12 years ago with this Jake craze started on these boards everyone wanted Jake's
Definitely useful an an 04 since they have the smaller brakes. Does the 4106 have the larger brakes of the 4905? You can do fine without them if you use the advice about going down in same gear as climbing. Also, you should have a tachometer to make sure you aren't overspeeding the engine. But,..... let's say you are starting to descend a long steep grade or mountain, unaware that one of your rear axle seals started leaking some miles ago and you didn't know it???? Add inexperience from a newer driver. I don't know. If we hadn't sold the 4104, I would have installed them on it for sure, as that scenario happened to us up in Maine on a trip at the bottom of a steep exit ramp. Coach stopped, but not well. One rear wheel seal let go and it really effected stopping ability. I learned years ago from my father who drove trucks back during WW2 about the proper braking and gear selection of a heavy vehicle on grades, and have never had problems yet. But, like they say, #@*% happens. What about the younger conversion drivers with have little or no clue about proper use of brakes on a heavy vehicle? I vote for them for me. YRMV
Being an old trucker (21yrs, 1.3 million miles)-the first thing I did to the bus before even bringing it home was to have Jakes installed. Everyone says that a Jake on a 8V-71 is useless. After Don Fairchild adjusts them, I can come down the 6% north bound 5mi grade of the I-5 Grapevine pulling my car at nearly 35,000lbs and still have to switch between one and both heads on the Jake brake to keep from slowing down too much. And living in California, I'm in the mountains all the time. I have a V730. If you pull the trans down to first, you'll get lockup in first-down to 20mph (both decelerating and accelerating to go up a long grade). I have gone over passes (highway 4) in first gear all the way up, then in first down with Jake brake. I can't imagine not having a working Jake brake. Course, my transit also has the largest drum brakes available which helps.
If you have a lightweight bus (under 30,000lbs), you could get away with no Jake. But you'll be much more at ease driving with one. There's a real good reason most all Diesels now have Jakes built into them standard from the factory. Good Luck, TomC
I just had my first trip to Eagle, Alaska, the end of August, in a 2008 J4500.I would not want to make that trip in this coach without jakes......Bill
Com'on guys you are starting to compare the 4 strokes to the 2 strokes with Jake's now this guy has a 8v71 and probably highway gears
Don't try Don's adjustment at home he knows what cam ,valves are in the engine and which control valve,big pad or small pad,mater slave and fork assembly in the housing you can put a valve through a piston fast by not knowing
Well that opened can of worms haha, I'm still gonna have to see . I do have many miles under my belt and plenty of thinking head of time . Have never had prob with mountains in northern n.h.maine and Vermont all narrow windy and some 15% and up . I have never been west of Minnesota so hearing bout these mountains out there makes me think of my passengers uno . Maybe not a problem I'm just careful (sometimes) my wife wouldn't agree ! You oughta see me on my 110 ci screaming eagle goad glide ...nother story . But still curious bout jakes .. Maybe I just like the sound haha thanx everyone it's all great advise I like all sides stay safe all I hope to meet up one day!
Haha that was miles not lies haha
Bruce -
Back when they were in revenue service, Greyhound ran these all over the USA without Jakes. That's also back in the days when Greyhound's training classes taught the drivers how to "drive" the coach, not simply "stab 'n steer" like today's dog jockeys.
You've mentioned the speed bumps you call mountains back in your neck of the woods - how about I-80 WB from Reno, NV to Sacramento, CA. That highway's got 70 MILES of continuous 4, 5 and 6% grades, enough to challenge ANY heavy vehicle's brakes.
When I worked charters, a fully loaded (45 passengers + luggage) MC-9 with a 6V92/HT-740 Jake-equipped powertrain would hold a steady 60-62 mph all the way down the hill without ever having to touch the brakes, as did the 8V71 models. That also meant that the brakes stayed cool, thus providing some additional safety margin compared to the folks with much warmer shoes & drums.
That same drive with either the manual, non-Jake 4106s or 4905s in the fleet meant dropping off Donner Summit on that highway in 3rd, hovering between 40-45 mph and having to use the brakes to keep it in that range. No heavy braking, just light control only. By the time you got just below Auburn where I-80 levels out, you could definitely feel the difference in the warmer brakes.
Thus for me, as a SAFETY feature, I vote for a Jake brake - especially for those who did not spend any time in the HD vehicle industry.
FWIW & HTH. . .
;)
I would go for the Jakes if you can. Thats on my fix it list they are installed but not working LOL
Jakes can be another high maintenance item on a 2 stroke if you drive a lot of miles you have o-ring,solenoids,jumper tubes,buffer switches and clips that break they are not just plug and play.
RJ mention 4905 I didn't think GM ever offered Jakes.The MCI 8 was the first for MCI,Eagle the 10 in the 80's was their first.
Buy the Jakes from some one you know and trust the Ebay sellers will sale you junk and it can get expensive rebuilding and make sure you get all the parts.
Just a suggestion never by the Jakes with 71 stamped on the housing buy the 71/92 stamped housing the 71 housing need to be set so loose for clearance they don't do much. Keep track of the cost it will surprise you at the final cost for Jakes buying the fuel lines valve cover gaskets and the 4 bolts with the new rubbers seals at DD will make you have the BIG one ;
Lee,
I am still thinking about you driving a 45 footer on 49. That's my neck of the woods. I have a friend who lives in Cool, CA. I always tell him yep we will come up but not bringing the Bus. Auburn to Cool don't know how you did that one. Even the turn onto the Bridge is tight for a 45 ftr. then the twisty climb next to the American River. I have come up through Rescue and that's much better.
Dave5Cs
luvrbus sure nailed that one, I was lucky to get the 71/92 setup and the 71 bridges, bought the overhaul kits for the 8V, new jumpers and the tools, was able to have a great working setup, always very particular on settings & clearances. When put them on the 92, bought the new bridges, all worked great too. Hell still have (1) 6-71 cast aluminum valve cover, Non Jake from the 12V sperience. Anyone want it, (FREE, come & get it) have the mounting hardware for it, will need a new seal gasket.
Dave M
Quote from: luvrbus on September 12, 2014, 07:04:14 AM
RJ mention 4905 I didn't think GM ever offered Jakes.
Clifford -None of the GMs in the fleet had Jakes except one, the last 4905 they bought. That Jake was retrofitted by the shop, it didn't come OEM.
FWIW & HTH. . .
;)
I just will not cut the tailgate and install the hump on the back if the owners want Jake's on a GM from me they cut the own deck lid ::)
You do not have to cut the tailgate on a 4905 and equiv models. Just remove molding in center and install a box shaped piece of aluminum. I'm surprised that R&M fiberglass doesn't make a nice bulged insert piece for it. Not sure if the center panel on an 06 tailgate is removable.
On my AMGeneral, I removed the valve cover bulge in the engine door and just left the valve cover exposed. You'll know it's me since I painted a face on the valve cover (LOL)
Clifford,
The only thing holding my back door together any more is the sheet metal :D Since it needs fixed anyway, I will put a "fashionable" bump out in the center section. I have a guy working for me right now that builds race cars(when he is not building aircraft parking in a "hostile environment") who is going to fix my door for me. He has several ideas that could start a whole new trend in engine door customization! ;D ;D
Steve Toomey
PAbusnut
Get the jakes. For steep grades, RJ is right on. You can always turn them off. Once you have on an automatic, you'll wonder how you got along without them. 6% grades are manageable w/o, but 2 lanes at 8% and 10% downhill with curves as you will see out east, are a different story.
;D Good grief some of the old 8v71's in the old buses don't even have enough oil pressure to activate Jakes
Maybe these books may be useful to some.
http://www.mountaindirectory.com/ (http://www.mountaindirectory.com/)
Some good posts on grades here:
http://www.thetruckersreport.com/truckingindustryforum/experienced-truckers-advice/88646-steepest-grade-you-ever-pulled-went.html (http://www.thetruckersreport.com/truckingindustryforum/experienced-truckers-advice/88646-steepest-grade-you-ever-pulled-went.html)
You guys with a auto and Jakes on a 2 stroke try highway 125 in Pennsylvania I forgot about that jewel it's about the same as 89A here in AZ ;D
8v71 v730 allison with jakes...
Bus had them when we bought it. We are in mountains any direction we travel from home base. Could easily go with out jakes, but has to be easier on the brake shoes. I love the sound too,
was double awesome when we were straight piped;D
Mark
Ps we run delcac 1240 oil
Delo 400 in the auto
And our antifreeze is green
What number of replys are we up to?
Route 125
East section of the Mountain Directory East:
Pennsylvania highway 125
(between Shamokin and Good Spring, PA.)
Large vehicles may want to avoid this 18 mile section of road. It crosses four mountains and includes numerous 15 mph hairpin turns and many more 20 and 25 mph curves. Regardless of your direction of travel you will have to climb and descend some very steep hills. Much of the grade is 7 to 9% but there are numerous sections that must be 12% or more, some lasting almost a mile. Brake shoes don't have enough time to cool much between descents.
That's what I'm trying to figure out . Ino we only have speed bumps in the east . But I have been on 125 in pa with bus and common sense has prevailed . We have mtns no bull in n.h. That are 15% plus for miles and 2 lanes even 1 lane and turns that r 180 deg quite the pucker factor haha.You pray no ones coming! When u come across 302 other side of Franconia notch u know what I'm sayin .or across the Kanc coming into lincoln .I guess if I can get up them I can get down them . Time will tell . We have highest peaks in the east ! Maybe just lil bumps but that's prob why they have the runaway areas for when u lose brakes on the bumps haha anyway thanks for all the tips . I like lvrbus thoughts . I'm gonna try wat they did for so many yrs .But my 8v71 does have 65 lbs at idle .so I'm sure they would sound great! Lol I think I will keep running these bumps for a few thousand more miles than try the big bumps out west thanks all !
Not to be a smart @$# with 65 psi at idle on a hot 8v71 I would be looking for another gauge ;)
You think ? Maybe I will but it does go to zero and my gauge out back is bout same. I do run straight 40 delo 100 and the motor is fresh . I had multi grade in it before and she only had 30 psi I didn't know any better I was told run the multi delo u think both gauges are bad ? If not is there a problem or something I need to look at? Uno as to why the high pressure. She sure runs awesome
You never need to worry about a 8V71 having to much oil pressure on a old DD ::) 10 to 15 lbs at idle and around 50 at 1800 rpm when hot is about the norm for a good 8V71
Quote from: luvrbus on September 13, 2014, 06:51:46 PM
You never need to worry about a 8V71 having to much oil pressure on a old DD ::) 10 to 15 lbs at idle and around 50 at 1800 rpm when hot is about the norm for a good 8V71
true story....
8v71s are some tough iron. I have only ever had 5 at idle and 30 at speed. The minimum spec according to Detroit BTW. I have newer iron sitting ready to go in but as long as what I have keeps going, then I have better things to do with the kids.
I am lucky, my bus came from the PO with Jake's and they are set up quite well, steep grades and quite often no brakes. I do hills both east and west that most here would not consider, but I will admit that if you are careful you can get by without them, mostly I leave them off and use a momentary foot switch that I use like an on/off brake. The bottom line for most is that a lot of those without them seem to want them, and it is easy to go to the boards looking for justification. If you want them and you can afford it then do it, especially if it makes you feel more comfortable and removes any anxiety over the issue. Also as was mentioned by Brian, I seem to use mine a good bit in the stop-and-go traffic of the city, so they are not exclusively just for the big whoop-de-doos. So my take is: Fun to have, not required.
When I was driving my first Diesel truck with 6-71, I never checked the oil. I knew it was time for a gallon when the oil pressure went from 32 down to 28. I let the engine idle all night once while I got a Hotel room it was so cold out. In the morning there was an oil puddle about a foot around under the engine. It didn't care. Good Luck, TomC
I completely agree with Barn Owl. If you can afford and want Jakes, get them.
I bought a set for $500, spent $300 on the rebuild kit, another $200 on switches, etc., and I installed them. I love using them, definitely part of the 'fun factor' of driving the bus.
On the otherhand (if you can even say that) everything Clifford says about setting them up is true, too. If it's not done right, Jakes aren't very effective on a two stroke. I got lucky, I installed new injectors and the old time marine DD wrench was thrilled to see Jakes again. He had all the tools and manuals. After his tune up my Jakes worked better than I ever had them working. All that said, I'm happy with them, they work great, I use them all the time (maybe even too much), I don't regret the expense. We own these buses because they are fun, right? Right!
You better check the gauge or sending unit. No way you have that much pressure. I think the low pressure warning is set for 4 psi. Detroits are known for low idle pressure and bearing problems aren't a normal issue. (at least on 71 series) 6-8 at idle and 25 to 40 at rated speed is common. A Lot of oil is bled off those engines for lubing accessories.
The Operating Manual for my 5A says, " normal readings with engine hot are; Idling 11 lbs. minimum. Governed Speed: 30 lbs. minimum. Engine must not be operated when oil pressure falls below 30 lbs. at governed speed under full load."
Turbo engines will have less oil pressure than the N/A engines they will run forever at 5 lbs at idle and less than 30 lbs of oil pressure so I wouldn't worry about the 11 psi at idle
Back to Jakes they say 15 lbs min oil pressure lol I can't get them to work around 20 lbs. Gearing plays a big part in the oil pressure buses with the 4:11 and above carry more oil pressure and the Jakes work better I gotta do this ::)but if you want more oil pressure dump the Delo 100 and go with the Delvac 1240
IMO they work better with the 730 and standard than they do with the 600 and 700 series Allison's
Where do you find the Delvac 1240? Have never seen it on the self anywhere, only the Delvac 1300.
Using jakes in the city is for cowboys.
You can get it Vegas ED at Western Petroleum on the north side
Get the jakes now as they are going to be harder to find used and be more expensive in the future.
I have Jakes on my bus, and with my new resonator muffler I can actually hear them come on now. My wife followed me a bit, and said they could be heard behind the bus no problem. I make sure to have them off in town, but earlier this summer I went to Mosport, big name race track just outside Toronto, and they have a big new tunnel for big rigs to get inside the track. I made sure to be in first gear and with the jakes on going through that tunnel, and the sound was glorious! I live on a road that lumber trucks pass by, and some of those are straight-piped and have seriously loud jakes, I like the sound of a truck working. Loud motorcycles (the really loud straight piped ones) piss me off, that is noise for noises sake, but a truck working hard for a living I like. I wave, they wave back. It's a Maritime thing maybe.
Brian
Hi Ed, Mobil delvac 1240 40W as Clifford said, Western Refineries, 7022697880 Debbie Haynes, 2949 No. Lamb, North Las Vegas, Nv. They are the Mobil Oil Distributers, 5 gallon pale $81.85, lvmci...
PS, when you come for the dam rally you can pick some up!
I like the sound of a truck working. Loud motorcycles (the really loud straight piped ones) piss me off..
they actually save lives...really. people tend to swerve away from the sound versus towards it...
Tell me again how hard your bus is working... ;D
Quote from: bevans6 on September 16, 2014, 01:42:42 PM
I have Jakes on my bus, and with my new resonator muffler I can actually hear them come on now. My wife followed me a bit, and said they could be heard behind the bus no problem. I make sure to have them off in town, but earlier this summer I went to Mosport, big name race track just outside Toronto, and they have a big new tunnel for big rigs to get inside the track. I made sure to be in first gear and with the jakes on going through that tunnel, and the sound was glorious! I live on a road that lumber trucks pass by, and some of those are straight-piped and have seriously loud jakes, I like the sound of a truck working. Loud motorcycles (the really loud straight piped ones) piss me off, that is noise for noises sake, but a truck working hard for a living I like. I wave, they wave back. It's a Maritime thing maybe.
Brian
Just wanted to let you know Loud pipes save life's Riding a bike is dangerous when people pull out in front of you!
Loud pipes can only be heard behind you. They do nothing for left turners or anything else, this backed up by insurance studies. I say this as a motorcyclist and instructor for 40 years. I ride with quiet pipes. I have no time for straight-piped bikes, I want them outlawed and off the streets.
Off topic or what?
Brian
Quote from: bevans6 on September 23, 2014, 04:26:42 PM
Loud pipes can only be heard behind you. They do nothing for left turners or anything else, this backed up by insurance studies. I say this as a motorcyclist and instructor for 40 years. I ride with quiet pipes. I have no time for straight-piped bikes, I want them outlawed and off the streets.
Off topic or what?
Brian
you brought it up....I actually think jakes in a tunnel are a lot more irritating....agree ?
so your pipes are glorious and harlyman's aren't.....little one sided.... ::) ??? ::)
I made sure to be in first gear and with the jakes on going through that tunnel, and the sound was glorious! I made sure to be in first gear and with the jakes on going through that tunnel, and the sound was glorious! I live on a road that lumber trucks pass by, and some of those are straight-piped and have seriously loud jakes, I like the sound of a truck working. Loud motorcycles (the really loud straight piped ones) piss me off, that is noise for noises sake, but a truck working hard for a living I like. I wave, they wave back. It's a Maritime thing maybe.
My little bus has an exhaust brake. I tried it out today for the first time on a long 7% grade near me. They held my bitty 10,000# bus at 45 mph all the way down the hill. I'm sold!
BTW, the bus climbed the same hill at over 50 mph with its little 5.2 l 4 cyl turbo diesel--I'm stoked! Still, it would be nice to have a real bus :). Jack
Jack-at times it's nice to have a smaller motorhome. While I like my 40ft'r, I'm looking for a less than 25ft'r to be able to do quicky weekenders-say to state parks that mostly have 25ft restrictions. Something like the Lazy Daze 24ft twin king is what I'm talking about. No slides, huge windows. Good luck, TomC
Tom I have a 1973 Winnebago Indian for sale, great motorhome, very solid(back then they had a lifetime warranty on the body), rebuilt engine, new tires, everything works including the Onan Generator and AC, all original paint etc. At 22feet long and 10 feet high you can park it just about anywhere.
Funny thing-we rented a brand new 1973 Winnebago Indian 22ft with 413 Dodge engine in it from the owner-hadn't even taken it out for himself yet. Not a bad rig, but rides like a truck. I imagine putting air suspension in the rear would solve that. And not a fan of the sandwich walls used in the 70's. Good Luck, TomC
I know off topic but. Did start it haha ! My screaming eagle 110" ci sounds like jakes when I back off throttle and people hear it in front of me behind me and 10 mles away in all directions haha! Thanks harley man if know where your coming from . And t takes a legal n.h. Sticker with decimal meter . She sure is loud kids and wives run when they here it!lmao
Quote from: bevans6 on September 23, 2014, 04:26:42 PM
Loud pipes can only be heard behind you. They do nothing for left turners or anything else, this backed up by insurance studies. I say this as a motorcyclist and instructor for 40 years. I ride with quiet pipes. I have no time for straight-piped bikes, I want them outlawed and off the streets.
Off topic or what?
Brian
Brian I have heard bikes come up behind me on the freeway going 70 and I have had no problem hearing them, it's true some are very quiet but some you can clearly hear coming up from behind, don't know where that insurance company study came from but I don't think it is all that correct. Just saying
I have had buses pass me running straight (no muffler) exhaust and the noise is terrible. It makes a straight pipe Harley sound like a Honda Civic. I have Harleys and when I boosted my 80" Evo to a Stroker 89"er I went with the "Thunderheader" pipe-- the noise was so bad I had to wear eaplugs and that was not enough. Finally I sacrificed great performance by putting the stock pipes back on. Still hauls @$#, but I can live without performance for some peace and quiet.
I would never run straight pipes on my RTS bus conversion.
--Geoff
I really don't care if people like my loud Harley or not, because I love it ;D
Quote from: harleyman_1000 on October 11, 2014, 06:41:32 PM
I really don't care if people like my loud Harley or not, because I love it ;D
That's exactly what I say about my rap music on my boombox!
What did he say. sorry too many years with out mufflers, hello is anyone out there. I will put in my hearing aids, OK there you all are, Potato, potato, potato.........
Dave5Cs ;D
Yea a 60 series has real Jake brakes ::)
Excellent subject matter by the way and thank you. Now my story. Way back in about 1970-71 when I was pretending to go to college I drove a School Bus part time for the Kern High School District in the pretty city of Bakersfield CA. My daily assigned ride was a fairly new 1963 Crown Supercoach 40 foot 10 wheeler 92 passenger bus.
The route then was daily down then up the Grape Vine South of town on Interstate 5, although it might have been named highway 99 back then. Too long ago. Anyhow, a 220 hp non turbo 743 Cummings. Jake Brake. RTO 910 Fuller. With a full load of about 50-60 kids, we came down the Ridge at about 25-30 mph without touching the brakes.
The Jake was an incredibly effective SAFETY DEVICE. Also about tranny retarders; I will NOT tell you a true story where a unnamed fire agency fire engine was returning from down South coming down the same North bound Ridge Route at 75 mph with the Allison retarder in the "max" position. Burned up the automatic tranny. Big $repair$ job. The stupid so called "deserving" Engineer did not know what he was doing, which is typical.
Jake Brakes dump about 70% of the absorbed heat energy back into the water radiator and 30% out the exhaust pipe as heat and noise. This keeps the engines warm going down steep grades, which is good. Auto tranny retarders dump all the heat into the tranny oil cooler with mixed results. However ... Telsa, (sp?) type retarders are fine?
Jakes work. Yes they are noisy, which is part of the fun, games and giggles of owning a Bus Conversion. They also have a particular place in large fast coaches that tend to come down the hills as fast as they went up them which could be exciting at times. You will be very happy with a Jake Brake. I would not own a Bus Conversion without one.
PS; I now want to do a cheap rat rod street pickup truck powered by an old DD 353N. Why? Because it can have a Jake. A real one. not a potato brake.
Just me. HB of CJ (old coot) :)
Am I the only one who only wants jakes for one reason and one only? The noise :)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk. Clumsy fingers may contribute to mistakes.
Nope Scott your not, I also would like a set for my 6V92. My Harley also has loud pipes and has saved my but a time or two.
Having the grand experience of using the Jakes on the MC7, 12V-71 in a tunnel (I-64 Hampton to Norfolk) finding how using them, the traffic just stops behind you, guessing in a mild case of panic ?
Dave M
On www.govliquidation.com (http://www.govliquidation.com) the military is constantly auctioning off used take out and some new rebult 8v92's and they all have jakes on them. I wonder what the buyers are doing with all the jakes being removed from them. Some on ebay at times. Is there a difference on jakes on an electronic verses a mechanical 8V92. One of the military bases in Texas a while back had about 100 8V92's being auctioned off I wonder where they all went. Probably scrapped to China.
Detroit Diesel is hard to compete with trying to buy those engine my understanding they go to Carolina to the new engine rebuilding plant location the sale of 8v92 has slowed way down just about all has been replaced with C-15 Cat engines
Cummins ran the price up so high on the new Cummins engines not long ago the average person couldn't touch one seems like they paid 64 grand for 1 lot
Jakes work so well now and they are so much more quiet, there is an option to have the brake lights activate when the Jake is activated. Good Luck, TomC
I have a 4106 with a 8V71 and 4 speed I can come down 6% grades at 60mph without touching the brakes all day Jakes are great.
A 4106 doesn't weigh much either add another 20,000lb and 5 ft and see how good they are in 4th gear on a 6% grade
I just committed to a 24Vdc set for my 4905 8V71. Have to wait till the weather warms to get them installed.
This is my partial solution to my fear of heights.(I don't fear falling, it is just the sudden stop at the bottom that I fear!)
Cliford
The freightliner plant in NC has a place that they take your old wore out freight liner and rebuilt ever part to new
specs from the year they were built.
Its called re enginering them.
See a lot of new looking old trucks running around here.
uncle ned