Ken's post on driver air and Sean's desires to keep cool brought this topic forward. Windshields and sun are heat killers--Giant solar ovens! Idea is drivers air off engine but for some it is a $ point that is a project killer. If your drivers air evaporator is still there maybe not so much because at least part of the hard work is done and hopefully the lines still exist to rear. Old Ford type air compressors with 12 v clutches and adding a condenser with electric fans can make a simple junk yard dash air. Or a commercial Red Dot system like Clifford suggested. I also used a 20 inch ceiling fan above drivers seat to circulate air down on me. Mirrored window tint starting 3 inches above drivers line of site will reflect solar heat outward yet you can see thru it. I checked with State Police before I did it to make sure it was OK. Please get your own opinion. Just my thoughts. To cool a hot subject. Bob
20 inch ceiling fan $42 at Lowes. Use to circulate air otherwise to prevent heat layering top to bottom. Bob
Bob,
One of the things I always liked about you was your simple, as inexpensive as possible, approach to solving problems with your bus. Please keep throwing out those ideas. certainly do appreciate them.
Frank
Hi Bob On my bus I removed the old compressor,condenser ,misc from the front compartment but I left the lines,the front heater-ac is still there. Is the small line that came in to the condenser compartment the one from the front drivers ac. If so what do I need to make the drivers ac work ? new condenser (will a p/u truck ac unit work with a 12 fan ) a p/u truck ac unit (belt driven ),some misc. parts from the bone yard .Or is there a kit I can buy that is not the price of a new bus ?? I work with wood so not to smart with bus ac unit. thanks dave
Does your 102 have the dual rad like the MCI 8's and 9's? Not for sure if they changed. Actually the physical size of the evaporator isn't that large. You can take a look at it. The aux /driver ac condenser on the prevost is about the size that you would find on a full size crew cab dually. Prob just a little bit larger. I have one out(condenser) will try to put a tape on it tomorrow. The experts can tell you exactly but I can give you a physical measurement of the one that matches my drivers (factory air). as for lines flex lines to start with in the engine compartment then join into lines like Ken did is simple way. You should have two lines to rear engine compartment where compressor was; so just a little plumbing. Ken might chime in and give you measurements before I get up to shop. Bob
Condenser size for prevost aux air 30 1/2 inches wide by 15 inches tall. Tube size is 3/8 OD. The aux ac compressor is mounted (2 stroke) passanger side oil pan level run off cam pulley. Flex hose is used to bulk head,then hard copper to front spare tire compartment then flex to evaporator. Don't know BTU capacity. Bob
Ken got hot driving. No drivers air. He installed a small room air conditioner in front right behind grill, so it is never seen from outside. It really is nice, and keeps it plenty cool. Some days, it is all that is needed to keep cool up front.
Roof air about four feet behind the drivers area, and two 7" fans on the dash - I find that moving air does work a treat. It's all a compromise if you don't have the powerful OTR air system any more.
Brian
I still have the original whole of bus AC and heater unit working plus the drivers sections as well, but find the driver part of the AC and heater system really does very little in the way of adding to my comfort over and above what I get from the main part of the system. It is just too small to be effective, the location and size of the ducting and outlets is pathetic and the air infiltration through body openings plus heat gain/loss through the windscreen is just too much to counteract.
I am quite interested in the window air units being used behind the front grill or as a basement unit. Has anyone documented the process to do the ducting? I think this is something that would work for me.
I'd love to know where/how you managed to fit a window A/C behind the grill. Photos?
My thoughts on this:
1) I have roof air, one that's about 10' behind the driver - I've thought about putting flat-ish ducting along the roof to take cool air from the front and drop it over the driver. Could make it so you could move the ducting in manually for when you're driving.
2) Wondering if anyone makes coating that is reflective only for non-visible light (UV and the such). You could coat the windshield with it and it wouldn't change visibility, but I'm guessing a vast majority of the heat energy comes in the non-visible spectrums.
We temporarily duct our front roof air over the drivers area and block off the rear vent so all the air is directed to us. Works well...even in 90 degree weather.
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Im brand new here, and am just a sponge, but I remember a old pontiac station wagon we had growing up( back in the 60's) had a self contained ac unit under the dash. Do they still make these? if so would it work?
Ck out Red Dot on internet. Lots of stuff out there to adapt to our $$$$ needs. Lots of bike guys here also. Bob
No doubt engine driven AC would be best, but we are managing without it. We have modified the forward AC, which is definitely too far back, to throw all its air out the bottom and frontward. It works reasonably well. It does help that we live in the low humidity desert, so 80 degrees is okay. I experimented with putting a fan on the floor behind the driver, but I don't think I saw the difference. In a pinch, we could curtain behind the AC but have managed without that.
I know that there has been periodic talk of using a portable unit, and I still sometimes consider it. I saw one that though a bit more expensive than others, was very compact and would fit nicely up front. Such a unit could help a lot and provide some system redundancy.
Hey All -
Here is our current plan for AC on the bus -
One 9000btu mini-split at the front of the bus above the windshields. We will have the capability to pull a divider and separate the drivers area from the living area of the bus so that would keep the air up front in the drivers cabin.
One 9000 btu mini-split at the mid section of the bus to cool the bunk areas and front living space of the bus.
One 9000 btu mini-split in the bedroom.
I may add drivers air at a later time but we are trying to stay on schedule to be full time by December so that will be further down the road. As far as electrical, I am trying to get as much as I can to run on 12v DC power. I was going to plan on getting a smaller AC unit to run off the alternator to cool the drivers area for those days where its only hot up there looking at the sun. I'll have to look to see if I have lines still in place as adding a belt driven compressor may be an option in the future but these red-dot systems might be worth looking at as well. Also - Might be easier and less work to add 12v alternator and run wires to a contained system than add a compressor and run tubing and find a matching evaporator.
Thanks to all of you for the suggestions. I awe at the amount of information and ideas that I get from this board.
-Sean
www.herdofturtles.org (http://www.herdofturtles.org)
Quote from: Seangie on September 25, 2012, 10:43:26 AMHey All - Here is our current plan for AC on the bus -
One 9000btu mini-split at the front of the bus above the windshields. We will have the capability to pull a divider and separate the drivers area from the living area of the bus so that would keep the air up front in the drivers cabin.
One 9000 btu mini-split at the mid section of the bus to cool the bunk areas and front living space of the bus. One 9000 btu mini-split in the bedroom. (snip)
Sean, I know women that throw wood on and poke the fire at 10 PM in May, but I think that you're going to find 27K BTu as being marginal if you're planning to have ~6 people in a bus anywhere south of Charlotte or Denver spring to early autumn. That kind of cooling will have a hard time de-humidfying (all things equal - you're going to have to do a lot of very good sealing to be better than average -- air infiltration is your enemy) much less dropping much temperature. You get BIG heat through the windshield but you'll also get big heat through the floor, windows, doors, etc. (even items that are well sealed). I'm not an expert but I am afraid you're looking at a marginal system; please ask other people to add knowledgeable data here.
40,000 btu's is marginal in the AZ heat parked much less driving lol
It's somewhat dependent on your insulating job Sean. As you know we have no only 1.5 inch foam, 3/4" plywood, but also two layers of Reflectix sandwiching the foam layers. We spent the summer in 101 degree heat in direct sun in Wisconsin this past summer and were able to stay comfortable with a single 13,500 BTU roof air. That being said, here are my disclaimers:
1. Other than the windshield and side glass, we have no windows yet.
2. We insulated well
3. The A/C unit ran literally nonstop the entire summer. We never shut it off.
We are definitely going to install a second unit at some point. Especially after we install some windows. But my mantra is insulate well...take the time and effort to do it at the beginning. We're about to spend our first cold winter in the bus in Ohio and we are thankful we insulated well.
I have three 13,500btu roof tops (Colemans) with the front one up close to the driver's area. I can aim the vent down to me and with a dash fan blowing in my face stay quite comfortable up to 108 degrees (hotest I've been in). When driving typically use the front and rear roof top and when parked the middle. I also have 2.25" sprayed insulation, but just single pane windows. If I were buying new roof tops again would, I would buy Duotherm Penquins at 15,000btu-mainly because Penquins have 3spd fan with their low being much quieter then the two spd Colemans. But-our Colemans have been 100% reliable since I installed them in 1994. Good Luck, TomC
You guys forget he has kids lol, hey TomC the new Penguin 11 model are 2 speed now that's why I bought the Coleman lo/pro
Quote from: harleyman_1000 on September 24, 2012, 02:05:45 PM
Im brand new here, and am just a sponge, but I remember a old pontiac station wagon we had growing up( back in the 60's) had a self contained ac unit under the dash. Do they still make these? if so would it work?
Funny you should mention that under dash AC unit, I have one of those in the garage sitting in a corner.....remember them very well.
Quote from: luvrbus on September 25, 2012, 02:43:06 PM
You guys forget he has kids lol, hey TomC the new Penguin 11 model are 2 speed now that's why I bought the Coleman lo/pro
Good point. And they are the cutest kids this side of the Mississippi! We love your kids Sean...but they are probably BTU makers ;) So throw in one more a/c
QuoteGood point. And they are the cutest kids this side of the Mississippi! We love your kids Sean...but they are probably BTU makers So throw in one more a/c
The BTU's are the last thing I am worried about them making. It's the dB's that they make that will drive you nutz :)
Well...I am ordering my first mini-split now. 12k, y'all talked me into it. This one will be used for the template to place the other 2 and make sure that they will all fit. It will be tight. :)
I'll post pictures once I get everything together.
-Sean
Good choice.
No one complains about having too much cooling or heating, but if you are short...
And a trio of 12's will pull the coach temp down faster when it is heat soaked in a parking lot all day.
I doubt you'll ever regret it.
happy coaching!
buswarrior
Sean We have a 9000 btu split heat pump . (I wish I had a 12000 btu unit ) The 9000 works great when we are camping lots of a/c .bus was spray foamed r 32 in ceiling r 15 in walls,r 12 in floor .All windows are thermopane .I put a rv shaker roof top 13.5 btu in the bedroom .Have only used it a few times as I can't stand the noise.The split unit is above the front window fits fine .A little head scratching to plumb. it in .I had to redo the water drain as you need a lot of fall due to off level happens a lot while driving. I use the inverter for power on the road 12volt 2000 watts. When I redo the battery bank (is 6 years old still works good ) I will change to 24 volt more power for a 24 volt inverter.The 9000 unit uses 8- 10 amps =80 to 105 amps at 12 volts . A 24 volt inverter would be only 40-55 amps . live and learn. dave
Sean here are some pics of my old mans a/c unit in his bus. i am his son Ty i had to do it because there is no way he could have found out how to do it. i am even amazed he knows how to work this comp to play on this site. now in order to put these on here i had to send them to face book then save them back to his computer then send them to here. there has to be an easier way to compres a photo down to post it on here. and man is your site slow.
and the other three because this is SSSSSSLLLLLLLOOOOOOWWWWWWW!
Not mini splits but I helped a friend install 2 of the new Dometic Penguins model 2's on his rv today he hit a tree limb they were not quite low pro enough lol
Anyway they have a new lower cover they have 3 adjustable vents 2 small and 1 large to blow down then 1 at each end to blow out nice setup with the 5 vents they only have a 2 fan speeds and seem to blow a lot more air than the older 3 speed fans a little pricey at 901.00 each at CW with the president's card
good luck