Yesterday I replaced the left rear height valve and due to the fact the bolts would not stop turning from the inside, this required that I remove the water heater that I so carefully installed a few years ago. Luckily I assembled plywood stand and enclosure with pocket hole screws and I did not use any glue on it. It came apart nicely and I was able to get to the bolt heads. I made sure this would not happen again by making a plate with 2 stainless steel bolts welded through it so the bolts can not turn in an inaccessible area. the rest of the installation was a piece of cake.
Well, I received new air bags for the rear of my MC5B yesterday and I need some advice on what is the best way to get the bead rings over the top and bottom of the bellows. I know there is reinforcing wires in the top & bottom of the bellows and it is probally important that this area not get bent or deformed.
From looking at it, I suspect the bolts need to be put into the ring and then the ring installed on the beads. Or maybe the bolts can be installed in the ring after it is on the bellows? If anyone has experience with this operation I would welcome any advice you have. Are there any tools that can make the installation easier with out damaging the beads? Is there any kind of lubricant that makes the ring easier to slide on the bellows?
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance.
Gene 1975 MC5B
I recently replaced the front air bags on an MC8. It takes two people, a screwdriver and a bottle of window cleaner (for lubricant) to get the rings onto the bags. After the rings are on the bags, you can use your fingers to push the bags in where the bolts go and push the bolts through.
Have fun!
--Geoff
I had absolutely no drama putting the rings over the beads when I changed my air springs - the stock double convoluted type. I just cleaned and painted the rings, and pressed the end the spring slightly oval with one hand and slipped them over. Took about as long to do as to think about it. I had new Goodyear springs.
Brian
The air bags I got from MCI were so stiff it took two people to get the rings on-- one person had to hold the bag and ring in place as the other person worked the ring on. They also gave us new rings and bolts with the bags.
Thanks everyone for sharing your experience with bead rings and bellows. I had a much longer reply typed in and then all of a sudden it was gone and I could not find it again. Thanks again for all your help. I will get back out in the shop and work on the camp/road leveling system. Replacing one of the bags is part of that project. The bag closest to the drive shaft u-joint must have been hit by something and nicked it. It is not leaking yet that I can tell, but now is a good time to replace it. :)
Gene 1975 MC5B
I have helped change several bags on my MC-7.
The retaining rings I received from MCI a couple of years ago were poorly stamped. No one realized this until months later we found the bag leaking at the plate where the retaining ring was malformed. MCI sent another ring and it appeared to be fine.
Also, the bolts go into the rings either way BUT the sloped top should be sloping outwards on the ring. Bolts installed half-turn out will leave a sharp edge protruding above the ring that could come into contact with the bag.
We also had one bag that continued to leak at the bottom plate for no visible reason, so I squirted some of the green TireSlime into the bag and it settled in the bottom where the leak was and stopped it. It shouldn't work its way into the air system, and it remains flexible. That was about 8 months ago.
Good luck!
Mark
"It is not leaking yet that I can tell, but now is a good time to replace it. Smiley"
I read this and my instant thought was "Oh you poor fool, there is never a GOOD time to replace an air spring, the best it gets is a not horrible sucky awful time to do that job..." ;D It took me probably two days to change mine, and not one of those minutes was a happy sharing fun minute...
Brian
I found that bike tire levers worked fine for changing the ring.
I replaced the bags on our MCI 8 all of them in less than a day sold the MCI and bought myself a Eagle lol, seriously air bags are not a fun job to change
I guess I'm doing it wrong. The air bags for my Neoplan came assembled and pressure tested; just bolt them to the mounts and hook up the air line.
Different bags Lee MCI uses air beams Prevost are a snap to change also
Only problem i had when i changed all of the bags on my 5A is that 2 months earlier i had dislocated my shoulder. When wrassling with jacks, blocks, and tires, i had to be real careful..... :) as it was, it was another 5 months :( before i was completely back to normal and could do things without having to stop and decide whether or not i was going to do damage to my shoulder.
Ed, I know the feeling. I partially tore my rotator cuff over a year ago and it's only been just the last few months that I don't have pain when lifting my arm over my head. Still have to be careful about heavy lifting/pulling with that arm.
Ed and Thomas,
When changing out the air tank on my 9 a couple weeks back I hurt my wrist so badly trying to tighten the air fittings with absolutely NO room to work with that I may have permanent damage. Whoever designed MCI's is losing my faith in them being reasonable people with well thought out plans when it comes to repairs. Like putting bolts "through" bulkheads and bay walls? What the hell were they thinking? A child has more common sense than the guys who designed some of these systems. I can honestly say i would not have bought an MCI if I would've known how little they planned for routine maintenance like Gene's airbags.
Meanwhile, I make my living playing guitar and singing and I can't play a B minor chord because of the genius that made me tear half my bus apart to get to 4 mounting bolts that should have been studs welded to the bus. Just makes you wonder what else the guy that designed the airbag system worked on. Rick
Hey Rick, just hit the first three strings and call it good. ;D ;D
When I said it was a good time to replace the Damaged air bag, I meant it is better to do it at home than on the road somewhere. Another good reason is it helps me justify the new pit I spend the last few months putting outside the shop. I have a pit inside the shop that I built before I got into buses, so it is not as long as it should be for working on certain areas of the bus. It worked great when I replace my MC8 front air bags with rolling lobes, but it also ties up the shop for longer than I wanted. Some friends of mine do concrete and we decided to put a bigger pit outside the shop and more cement in from of the shop. It took a while to get it done with their schedule and other jobs going on but we got it done about a month ago. I took lessons from the old pit and how I did that one in 1999. I built the forms in 2 half's on a portable car lift then I rolled them out and joined them together out side the shop. When we were ready to set the forms into the hole we just connected straps to the bob cat fork lift tines and set it in.
In this pit I put scaffold pockets in the concrete walls, so I can raise sections of the floor on 6" intervals. That way you can raise the floor to a suitable height for what ever you are working on. Right now the rear bags are right at my eye level and it is easy to work on. I am taking my time because I am also building a camping/road leveling system that I will incorporate into the old system when I put it all back together. Speaking of which I just got some more parts for that project so I better get out in the shop and put it together so I can test it. I need the current bags functioning so I can test the camp/road system before replacing the nicked bag. Thanks again for sharing your experience with the bags.
Ed, did you ever get your bay door struts rebuilt or replaced? I just finished doing the rest of mine when I replaced the bay door rubber hinges. Now they look as good as they work.
Gene 1975 MC5B
Not yet Gene. :) Got a line on somebody that is thinking about replacing his with gas struts, told him i wanted his old ones, haven't heard from him yet. ;D
Well, I got the old bags and rings out tonight, but I have a problem with bolt length. My bus has been plated due to pin holes in the air beams so the 1/2" plate at the top of the bag mount requires longer bolts than came with the kit. Does anyone know if the plate kits are supplied through MCI or a third party vendor?
The top bolts were in the worst shape because dirt and road grime can sit on them and rust them over time. I used a 3" cut off wheel on a zip tool and cut the bolts off at the nuts. they were so rusted I doubt if I could clean them up enough to reuse them anyway. The bottom bolts came off better, but I have new bolts that fit that location anyway.
Does anyone know about a source for the longer bolts? I will call MCI in the morning to see if they can supply longer bolts.
I started cleaning up the surfaces tonight but is was getting dark so I will finish it in the morning.
Is there any suggestions about any kind of sealer that could be used when reassembling the bellows to the metal surfaces? On a new surface it might not be needed, but these surfaces are far from being new. I will sand them as smooth as I can and paint them up good before I reassemble the system.
Thanks for any information anyone can give me. Gene 1975 MC5B
Don't use any sealer on the bags, just bolt them up. The longer bolts can be had from Mowhawk MFG, or Luke @ UScoach, or Caylor supply.
You can get it all from Luke at US coach. When you buy things like air bags from him, he would ask if it were plated and send the right bolts. They do cost a little extra.
Thanks for the advice on where to get the longer bolts. I ordered my bellows kit from Mohawk and they did not ask about if the bus was plated or not. I will call them now and see if they have them. Thanks.
Gene
FYI The bolts in the original Bellows assembly are 1.25" long. There is a longer bolt(1.75") normally used on GM buses and that part number is 2354549. They are $3.07 from Mohawk, so I ordered 24 of them. I have 2 new bellows kits and there are 12 bolts in the top ring where the plate is. Mean while the bus stays over the pit. No rally/gathering this weekend.
Gene
I had exactly the same problem with short bolts and plated air bags, and had to order the longer bolts. Oh, and I used silicone as a sealer top and bottom. No leaks.