I went ahead and signed up for the Bendix Air Brake School held in Charlotte NC a couple of weeks ago. Not only is it complete as regards the theory of how air brakes work and the details you need to know to service them and select the proper parts, it's also thorough in its coverage of the details of trouble shooting. It's not cheap at $300 but air brakes are something that I don't want to be a "backyard tinkerer" about.
Like everybody else, I sure hope that I don't have to be lying on my back under my bus in the dark while it's raining to fix some problem with my bus, but if I ever have to, I have training in how to do it, reference materials to help me (lots of written info is provided for you to keep), and knowledge to help me build a reasonable kit of spare parts and service materials to be ready if I need it.
Some of you may remember that when I began working on my bus, I found leaky valves, rusted tanks, corroded lines, damaged components, etc. so that I had to removed everything between the compressor discharge line and the slack adjusters (except for the brake pedal air valve). Also, my parking/emerg brake was a 4-foot long lever with a 5/8" steel rod to the rear wheels -- no air parking/emerg brake at all. Finally, the system on my bus as "linear" and provided little protection from a failure by a leak or component -- any problem would take down the whole system while more modern systems are "distributed" and their isolated nature means that failures may disrupt the functioning of one part of the system but would still allow emergency functioning of service and the parking/emerg systems. I had designed and installed a system of tanks, air lines, valves, spring brake canisters (for the rear, new plain cans for the front) etc. entirely from scratch, following details provided by Bendix technical info on-line. During a break, the instructor and I went through my diagram for my system and discussed the components that I'd selected, their specs (like crack pressure or PSI settings for protection valves), the location of tanks, my selection and installation of the rear relay and anti-compounding valves for primary service and parking/emerg functions, locations and function for one-way valves, pressure protection valves, and the air regulation valve for my transmission shifter, and similar details. Also, my bus was built without a governor and without governor control valves in the compressor; Bendix makes components available to convert this system (which they call a "European Discharge Line Unloader") to a system for which parts are readily available in N. America and we discussed how to select parts and install them to make this change. This little personal detailed review of my buses exact needs was worth the price of the course. (He didn't find anything wrong with my design or parts that I selected except he did recommend moving the point where I take off air for the transmission shifter and its one-way valve; he said that what I had done wasn't really wrong but his suggested mod will provide fewer points of possible leaks and failure and will provide a more reliable supply of air. He also discussed my layout of the new emerg/parking brake and, while he agreed with what I'd done, he pointed out critical areas that should be kept in case I need to do any future mods. I may be a backyard tinkerer but maybe I'm not a complete idiot.)
The course is three days, 8-5. The last 4 hours or so are spent on items such as servicing the newer Bendix systems installed on new vehicles (ABS, stability control, etc.) that are irrelevant to our buses (although working through those materials does highlight and reinforce important principles that we'd considered earlier and which are important to us). Thus, there's very little that's off the topic of things that we would need in real life - not really any "time wasted".
I hated the $300 hit but I sure am glad that I went through the course and got the knowledge and information. I'm just hoping I'll never need it on the side of the road at night during a rainstorm.
BH NC USA
Very cool, Bruce - is there a website URL to get more info on how to sign up? Thanks, Brad
You need to check before enrolling in a Bendix Class in your area they have different levels depending on what a sponsor wants,I sit in on a ABS-6,ESP and ATC class a few weeks ago at 1 of Coles dealerships amazing the technology of today's braking systems I still don't understand some of it but the free lunch was good lol the school is well worth the price you pay
Quote from: bkelly1011 on May 06, 2012, 05:19:05 AMVery cool, Bruce - is there a website URL to get more info on how to sign up? Thanks, Brad
Here is the place to start. You have to click links etc. to see the class schedule, locations but I think that this will do it.
http://www.bendix.com/en/servicessupport/brakeschool/brakeschool_1.jsp (http://www.bendix.com/en/servicessupport/brakeschool/brakeschool_1.jsp)
300 bucks is very cheap in my estimation...
one fix by yourself will more than pay for it.
come ta thimk of it... bcm could have free mechanical and conversion courses online..... ;D
instructors might differ about how to do things..... ;D ;D ;D
safety things like brakes would be good, though
just me 2c
I'm going to the Bendix Air Brake class in Chicago a month from now. I'm flying down because I got the airfare and hotel for free. (I normally drive to Chicago.) The $600 I will spend is cheap compared to the $1,500 I spent on brake repairs last year and had issues shortly after both repairs.
My understanding is the syllabus for these classes is standardized for the most part. I wish they had the class locally in Minneapolis, but apparently Bendix only does the class where they have a Bendix facility.
If the dealer has a class room they hold the class at the dealership also but most of those are advance classes the dealer pays for his employee training those are limited but if if they have a vacancy most dealers will let you attend because they pay for so many anyway and they do go to the dealers for those classes so what classifies as a Bendix facility ?
I have been to 3 at Coles dealerships over the years and they do get deep into the electronics at those way above my head lol
Quote from: belfert on May 06, 2012, 08:10:04 AM(snip) My understanding is the syllabus for these classes is standardized for the most part. I wish they had the class locally in Minneapolis, but apparently Bendix only does the class where they have a Bendix facility.
Yes, it's pretty clear from the handout materials (a big loose leaf binder with a variety of items, and other things like the current catalog) that it's standardized. The Charlotte class was held at the local community/tech college. Bendix has funded a brake tech lab. There is classroom with "cutaway" axles with brake drums and shoes or discs and calipers and a 20 foot long, ceiling high board with a full set of components mounted on it as they'd be laid out on a tractor-trailer truck with the facility to provide air and engage systems, simulate failures, etc. There are also pressure gauges so you can follow what's going on, brake canisters that move, color codes; this layout board lives in the brake tech room full-time. (The Charlotte college has 6 car bays, two full 14-foot tall bays, a full body shop lab with spray booth, engine and transmission and rear axle labs, auto electrical tech labs, welding classes, in its own auto tech building -- naturally, being where it is, there are a fair number of NASCAR-oriented classes and programs, too.)
If you look at the listing of Bendix company locations and the listing of class locations you'll notice that they have classes at pretty much every location except Mexico. They do have some classes at other locations, but one location appears to be a college lab that Bendix funded.
Quote from: belfert on May 06, 2012, 11:22:51 AM
If you look at the listing of Bendix company locations and the listing of class locations you'll notice that they have classes at pretty much every location except Mexico. They do have some classes at other locations, but one location appears to be a college lab that Bendix funded.
The "Huntersvile NC" class was the one I attended (Huntersville is a town very near to Charlotte). It was either full or very close to it.
Belfert I looked all the schools listed is for the foundation or fundamentals of the Bendix air system that's all they list on the web fwiw there is one going on right now at Volvo dealer here in Phoenix covering the Knoor Brake system some use and Bendix owns now
good luck
Quote from: luvrbus on May 06, 2012, 12:01:56 PMBelfert I looked all the schools listed is for the foundation or fundamentals of the Bendix air system that's all they list on the web fwiw there is one going on right now at Volvo dealer here in Phoenix covering the Knoor Brake system some use and Bendix owns now
good luck
Clifford, they don't make it clear but Bendix calls the "foundation brakes" the mechanical parts of the brake system (drums, shoes. pivots and springs, slack adjusters, discs, calipers etc.). It is a separate part of the syllabus and it's taught with separate handout materials (compared to the fundamentals of air brake components and systems) but actually in class -- and how you'd need it in the real world -- it's all pretty much mixed in so it's like one course. But the way they organize the materials and design the school, in theory, it's two separate courses.
I been to the class Bruce and have always recommended to people best bucks you can spend the manuals and the lunch is worth 300 bucks but all I am saying is they have advance classes for shops.
When I went to the basic class they didn't teach you how to use a Pro/Link and software on the brakes to reset the Wabco or other systems computers the last one did and I am still lost lol
Quote from: luvrbus on May 06, 2012, 12:24:08 PM(snip) When I went to the basic class they didn't teach you how to use a Pro/Link and software on the brakes to reset the Wabco or other systems computers the last one did and I am still lost lol
Yeah, class in Charlotte taught all the software stuff, too. Like I said, "we" are not likely to see that kind of stuff on buses that we buy in our lifetimes but it's good to learn it. And I'm still lost, too!
I think the days are getting numbered for the older buses on the highways even as a RV the class in Houston was about 1/2 Texas Dot officers learning how to read the system they already can check about everything on a bus or truck involved in a wreck
I was amazed the stuff they were telling could be done with a lap top and software at a wreck scene they had a name for the computers called it a "lap top attorney" it was the first item attorneys ask for a officer told me and fwiw they even use the method on a fatal automobile accident