I have a Heart Model 2400-12 inverter/charger on my BlueBird. It has been working fine. We took a trip over Thanksgiving & I noticed it would not run my laptop computer. It would run the other 120 volt stuff (TV, VCR, Satellite modem) but when I plugged in the laptop power supply everything died. I know the laptop is OK because it works everywhere else.
Tonight when we got back I plugged into my 50 amp service at my shop & everything in the coach works but the battery charger on the Heart is not working. Both the remote interface & the lights on the Heart show AC on & I have all 120 volt stuff working in the coach. The AC indicator light keeps going from red to green & I can hear the charger sound like it is trying to come on but nothing happens. I have turned the charger off for tonight until I can check it out tomorrow.
This much I know:
The 50 amp service checks good.
I have almost new AGM batteries & see no obvious problems.
Cables & connections look good. Most are almost new.
Nothing obvious wrong with the Heart.
Nothing smells burnt.
Voltage on battery bank right now is 12.60 with quite a few 12 volt lights on & my Autonet modem.
Any Ideas???
TOM
I think you already know that the charger section is kaput. And or the relay controlling the charger might have failed.
Now you need a good repair shop.
Good luck
Bill
Give it a mighty slap Tom. There's some relays in there that are a service item. If it starts charging when you whack it then you need new relays. I know where you can get that done in western Canada but that won't be a big help to you.
Don't be shy - hit the SOB.
Good advice but do not hit it too hard.
The failure is a switch that looks like a large relay and its located on the back of the front cover so that is why a whack may get it charging. Mine would not be beatin into submission but I know others that have been able to use that method to check it.
Pull the inverter and remove the cover, that is the front and the top. Mounted on the backside, mine was on top many are mounted back of the front, will be a clear plastic modular switch that you can see into, it will have exactly 9 wires going into it. Inside you will see 3 reeds with contacts on both ends of those reeds. Look very close at those contacts for pitting or burning. You may be able to file a bad contact enough to get it to work but you will need another.
The clear plastic cover can be removed and replaced without damage the switch is about the size of a large spool of thread and does look like an oversized relay.
Gusdorf Electronics Santa Fe NM That's your source I know he has them he bought a half doz when I ordered mine so he has more.
Chargers should NEVER kick out when a/c power is present. Repair should be about 40 bucks or so.
A good thing to do when you have opened up an inverter to verify it went back togeather correctly is to run d/c power to the inverter thru a 12 or 24 volt bulb depending on the inverter rating and have a very small load on the inverter. If things are correct it will work with dc going thru the bulb. If something is amiss you will blow the bulb instead of making smoke.
I practice this every time I have to open one up.
Also on that Heart there will be plenty of extra lead to open the cover and flip it open sufficiantly.
Be very very sure when closing it up that that group of wires folds up nice, they go into the correct same void they were in to begin with and nothing is pinched or squeezed.
As your opening it do it slow and look see how it all lays in there so you know going back togeather.
When our heart inveter quit charging, I took it to a authorized repair facilty in Bradenton, FL. They had to replace the charging contol board. As soon as he opened the case, while I was there, he pointed and said "there is your problem" 2 of the FETs on the board were burned. Like almost all other repairs facilities (including Onan, Dometic, DuoTherm, etc.) they do not repair boards, only replace them. Jack
Thanks for all the info! I will take a cursory look at it this afternoon. It's probably going to have to wait until later in the week for extensive exploration 'cause I've got to catch up on everything that didn't get done while I was gone.
I'll post the findings later.
THANKS!
TOM
"Jack what did that new board cost you 1000? Just guessing and curious"
It was several years ago, but I think it was about 300-350 including installation. Jack
If I was half ambitious I would make a thread with photos of putting a motherboard back into a Heart, Im hopfully doing it today.
Its Debbies BD and we have 1 of our grandaughters coming with her parents, christmas decorations are going up.
I cannot decide if I want to mess with the train set or the inverter ;D
Its gonna be a good day regardless.
O/K just got done reviewing my notes with a inverter on the bench with some rebuilt components and the test light trick that I mentioned prevoiusly in this thread was a bit incomplete and incorrect.
Anyone thinking they may open one up should copy this and stick it with your inverter stuff.
A safety light that is the same voltage as the battery bank is used as a protection when turning on an inverter that is in an unknown condition. It current limits the inverter's draw on the batteries. The safety light is connected in series with the positive post of the battery and the positive post of the inverter. If a 50 watt bulb is used on a 12 volt bank of batteries the limit is 4 amps when the light is on full intensity. If the safety light comes on at all during initial testing up to 7.5 watt load on inverters output there is a problem with the unit or wiring that NEEDS TO BE CORRECTED BEFORE PROCEDING with the test procedures.
(With some inverters a 50 watt bulb may start to glow after several seconds. Don't panic; try 100 watts)
Do not connect the inverter if it does not pass this test.
Next with the safety light still in series connect the a/c input with a 5 amp fuse and make sure the charger and transfer work without blowing the 5 amp fuse. Charger will cause the safety light to glow dimly.
OK folks.....
I whacked it pretty good & nothing changed. ;D I disconnected the remote & nothing changed. >:( I whacked it with the remote disconnected & nothing changed. :(
I hooked up a small float charger just to keep the batteries up for now. It's plugged in at the shop so I don't need the inverter. I have a 1000 watt Vanner inverter/charger I will try to install temporarily this week & check out the Heart at the same time. It's gonna be a busy week so I'm not sure when I will get time to look at it.
I'll post what I find & decide where to go from there.
Thanks for all the help & info so far
TOM
"Jack what did that new board cost you 1000? Just guessing and curious"
It was several years ago, but I think it was about $300-350 including installation.
Joe, I clicked on the wrong "button" and messed up your post. Sorry Jack
I took the cover off the inverter & can't find any contactors that can be serviced. I am attaching some pics so maybe someone can head me in the right direction.
TOM
Sorry Tom for misleading you. That doesn't even look a little bit like the inside of my Freedom 25.
Well maybe a LITTLE bit but definitely a lot different.
Tom if you look on the green motherboard on that one there is 3 black relays attached to 1 end of the board. I believe those are what is suppose to be making the auto switch.
On many where the transformer is mounted to the inside top on yours will be a stand alone relay/switch, many suggested you knock it there, but no matter you are on the right path.
505 983 4095 Gustorf Electronics if he can he will give you a test procedure over the phone and either narrow it down enough for you or you can remove the board and ship it to him for repair
Bob is the heart interface logo on the front in blue or red on yours?
I see you have colse to the same age bus and ours is the older unit case is identicle but labled in red
If it is labled in blue does it have EMS on the front access panel or does it say freedom?
I think there is 3 different configurations all on that same case. We have the original in our 85 and it is red and that's how we know for sure. But then there was the freedom AND the EMS and they too are little bit different too but not much really.
Toms I think is an EMS and the only place the case is marked with a model is on the front access plate if I guess right toms is model EMS 2800-12 or 24 whatever the case may be.
The freedom is also labeled in blue I have not had one of those opened but may be similar to ours. where the medium size transformer is mounted to the inside of the case on Toms photo there is a similar sized relay/switch instead (often clear). On toms the the big red and blacks and white go to the relays on the motherboard but on ours that relay is not intigrated ito the board it is seporate and the a/c commons and neutrals will be going in and out of it instead and the motherboard will not even have relays on it.
If yours is red like ours you have an older one ours is actually labled correctly at the bottom in the back and also on the front cover HF24-2500SXWF
Another dead giveaway is on the EMS the d/c goes in and out the back and the a/c goes in and out the front bottom.
On the old red ones they both go in and out the rear.
I can tell you for certain without a doubt that the older ones are way more powerful and officiant than the later models. The EMS drags the voltages down way quickerone we have I have had to use the EMS while we were fixing the other and it was quite different
Quote from: Joe Camper on December 18, 2011, 06:18:00 AM
Toms I think is an EMS and the only place the case is marked with a model is on the front access plate if I guess right toms is model EMS 2800-12 or 24 whatever the case may be.
Joe, mine says EMS on the front & Freedom somewhere else. Also, some of the paperwork says EMS2800-12 & some says Freedom or Heart. I didn't realize there was that much difference. If they were trying to confused the issue they were way late as I was already confused years ago.. ;D Thanks for the help & I will call & find out what's up.
TOM
Mine is white lettering on a black case - Heart Interface Freedom 25. On the inside there is a long PC board, somewhat like Toms but there's a mounting panel built into the case, as I recall parallel to and immediately behind the front panel. On that panel are mounted the relays and they are great big heavy duty relays - again as I recall there are 4 of them BICBW because three would seem like a more logical number, unless the fourth one makes the green/white bond.
Yes Tom I recognized yours because I have 2 of them here and it allowed me to compare the differences between the EMS and mine.
It will definatly say Heart interface and EMS and be lettered in blue and is in the identical case as the older model we have.
Now that I went back and looked into old photos the Freedom series is not that same case it is different than yours and mine.
Call that number I gave you and you will get it straight.