I plan to purchase and install a RV toilet. But recently saw a couple YouTube videos that have conversions with traditional home toilets. I got to thinking, why not? New toilets use 1.6 for a full flush and and something like 0.8 on a partial flush. That doesn't seem so bad.
Amy I crazy? I like that my home toilets have elongated bowls. That doesn't seem to exist on RV toilets.
Dave
It depends on your anticipated use. If you are going pole to pole, then a household toilet makes sense. If you are boondocking and every cup of water is precious, then consider an RV toilet.
If you are considering a household type then I would look into pressure flush models from Flushmate.
Household toilets aren't built to withstand the forces encountered in a moving vehicle. Not to say some won't work . . .
I haven't had any issues with my RV toilet, but since it is different than a household unit, we treat it differently.
With the RV unit, my family of 4 can go a week on a 30 gallon black tank.
RV units can weigh a lot less too. More water useage requires more water on board which adds more weight . . .
good luck with what ever way you choose to go.
You are starting to see the new home style toilets low water usage in the higher end RV's now,
I was told by a manufacture of RV's you can set the flush water on some of those sorry I forgot what brand and they just fill the tank a little less than 1/2 so sloshing water is not a problem now as it was in the past for 80 buck I would give it try
good luck
As a campground manager, here is a differing opinion.
If I find out you are using a house type toilet in the campground, you will be politely asked to leave.
The reason for this is that our septic tanks are easily overloaded, forcing solids into the leach lines.
Doesn't sound likely? think about this: most RV's hold 15 to 50 gallons of black waste, and another 15 to 50 grey tank. If you are a smart camper, you'll only dump when the tanks are full, if not, you just leave the dump valves open.
If you wait until your tanks are full, you'll toss up to 100 gallons, (or more), into our septic system that on any particular tank is 500 gallons. We have two tanks that are 1500 and 6 tanks that are 500. You'll be dumping about 7 times more often than a camper with an RV toilet, even with the low flow system. The septic can only take so much turn over before it has to be pumped. Septic Tanks require a period of recovery for the solids to sink and the liquids to pass over to the leach lines.
If you are one of the ones that leave your valves open all the time while parked and the toilet starts running because of a bad valve, you WILL fill our septic tank within a day.
If I go from site to site and determine it is your RV that is putting water into my system, (easily done), I will not only ask you to leave, but I will charge you $850 for a pump out. You don't like that idea? hmmm, to bad... that's what it costs here for the pump out. If you refuse to pay it or pay it and decline the charge later on your credit card, you will have a warrant sworn out against you for defrauding an inn keeper. You will pay, one way or another.
You can buy a nice Sealand china RV toilet for under $500. You can also buy a cheap American Standard house toilet for under $100. American Standard extended bowl toilets can cost upwards of $500 depending on the features you want.
Good luck to you, I hope it works out.
Everyone is different but if has a foot pedal I would not have one lol the Sea Land Magnum Opus they are a nice toilet little pricey at around 1000 bucks but nice
good luck
I had a house unit in my bus for a couple of years and it was fine and I enjoyed the elongated seat. The reason I changed it to an rv unit is because the wax gasket would become squished due to the road bumps and then it would leak.
The foam gasket works just as good as the wax for the house type
good luck
Quote from: Just Dallas on September 30, 2011, 03:17:12 PM
Doesn't sound likely? think about this: most RV's hold 15 to 50 gallons of black waste, and another 15 to 50 grey tank. If you are a smart camper, you'll only dump when the tanks are full, if not, you just leave the dump valves open.
Dallas,
I guess if we stay at your CG we shouldn't dump there, if you have a bunch of other campers. We have 150 black tank and 200 of grey :o ;D. We don't dump unless we are closer to capacity, then not...
John
I think of a toilet as a utilitarian item. It has a rather specific purpose. Since water supply and holding capacity can be important, I think the best option is the one that uses the least water. I have never really thought of it as something to enjoy, although I have been adamant about not having a seat studded with nails or lined with sandpaper.
"If I go from site to site and determine it is your RV that is putting water into my system, (easily done), I will not only ask you to leave, but I will charge you $850 for a pump out. You don't like that idea? hmmm, to bad... that's what it costs here for the pump out. If you refuse to pay it or pay it and decline the charge later on your credit card, you will have a warrant sworn out against you for defrauding an inn keeper. You will pay, one way or another."
Just Dallas,
I guess I do not need to come to Texas. This seems very excessive. I would think you would have some type of insurance to cover this type of problem. I'm just thinking, what would you say to the new camping person who happened to leave their system open (not knowing not best practice yet) and for some reason they have a problem and it does water log your system. If you do what I quoted...You would turn a new camper off from camping. Sounds to me like I would not want to stay in your park. If I have to go to the potty too much you are willing to put me in jail. Do you think everyone is out to mess up your park? I would just have to fight you in court myself......even if it may cost me more. Sorry if I sound mad, I'm not. Your post just sounds like you are out to get your campers for anything.
I will not only ask you to leave, but I will charge you $850 for a pump out.
and your customers know this before you take there money....??
I think I will start paying cash....
Where are you located?
i too have 160 gallon (combined gray black)
I think there might be some legal involvement here.
Just my .02 and worth atleast 1/2 that... :-* ::) :-*
Relax guys, that's Just Dallas. ;)
I think what he was referring to is not merely that they left the valve open, but left the valve open with water running continually. Even a new camper should know that the faucets should not be left on.
I would actually prefer an RV toilet in the house... No clogging, no need for a plunger ever again.
Quote from: Just Dallas on September 30, 2011, 03:17:12 PM
If you are one of the ones that leave your valves open all the time while parked and the toilet starts running because of a bad valve, you WILL fill our septic tank within a day.
If I go from site to site and determine it is your RV that is putting water into my system, (easily done), I will not only ask you to leave, but I will charge you $850 for a pump out. You don't like that idea? hmmm, to bad... that's what it costs here for the pump out. If you refuse to pay it or pay it and decline the charge later on your credit card, you will have a warrant sworn out against you for defrauding an inn keeper. You will pay, one way or another.
I would really like to know where are you located so I can avoid you like plague. Looks like you are not properly equipped and are highly combative also, not a good combination for somebody looking for a relaxing time. I suggest that the next time you make a post go SEVERAL times over it checking the wording.
I had a rv style in my alfa, (plastic or fiberglass) but my bus has a 12 volt style set up. It's porcelain and about the regular size in house. They tell me they are expense to replace. All the pump parts are under the toliet lid. Can't say which one is better.
glen
Easy on Dallas, guys. Of course, that will be in the TCs when you sign your name to stay there. For that much money, he probably mentions it too.
So make sure that you read the fine print, before you sign. That is how he could hold you to the charge, if it is in writing.
FWIW
John
Who would have dreamed that by asking about toilet style, I would be threatened by the campground Gestapo.
I am still building my coach, to date I have never stayed in a full hook-up campground. Even with my pull-behind camper we always stayed in less modern facilities. So, I don't know all the rules.
Correct me please (somebody besides the Gestapo). I plan to carry a rather large amount of water. Hopefully about a hundred gallons each of black and gray, and a couple hundred fresh. If I pull into a full hook-up campground, can I dump my black/gray? Or do I have to continue to carry it? It sounds from the Campground Prosecutor that I need to dump before hooking up or his system will overload and I'll have a court battle on my hands.
Certainly I never intended to grab this wild dog by his ears, but it seems it is a hot topic. Dallas, Let me know the rules and I'll play along, but this subject seems to be near and dear to your heart. Let us all know where you are located. I'm sure everyone here would like to stop by for a visit, we have something we would like to leave with you.
Oh, and I might suggest not making legal threats on this type of forum, there are some of us here who could enjoy the legal tango just for entertainment sake, far more than you could image.
Thanks for the input guys, I think I'll install a RV toilet after all.
Dave
Dave check the electric toilets out. I don't know the brands but the one in my bus is nice. Looks like the one in your house.
glen
I guess I need some education. What does the electric do in a toilet?
I've seen some a the RV suppliers, and couldn't understand what they are all about
Maybe somebody could post a description...
I guess they work like a conventional one without a water holding tank. Elongated bowl and looks like a short tank on back. Raise the lid and the pump and electrics under lid. Very heavy porceline like the one in house.
Wow, what a bunch of grumpy people.
Sorry I mentioned it.
I think you will find hidden in the rules of many campgrounds statements that allow them to charge you for any damage you cause.
It just like causing damage at a motel, if you tear up the room or steal the television, you will be charged for it. If you leave water running in a motel room, and plug the drains up, they can and usually will charge you for the damage.
Besides, these aren't my rules, I am only required to enforce them, although I can't say that I disagree with this particular rule. I was merely trying to inform you and others what the consequences of your actions could be.
Glen, most likely you have a Mircophor toilet in your Prevost pretty pricey toilet @ 1200 to 1500 bucks I had one in my Eagle they are used in rail service because they hold up to the abuse.
Check out the Mircophor site if you ever need parts they sell direct,and me personally I hate RV toilets with a foot pedal lol
good luck
Whoa, Cliff. I didn't know they were that pricey. I'm going to have to get my wife another job to support my habit! (busing)
Yep Glen people install switches on the wall were when they stand up the just push a button and flush they are a good toilet little over priced I think
good luck
Microphor toilets are fine and dandy for trains and public buses-but once you look at them-I'd have a hard time incorporating a toilet like that that is so industrial looking-I'm sure they are great toilets though.
Take a look at the Dometic all porcelain toilets that can use standard house hold type seats. They make two versions-one is a normal gravity drop toilet that is either hand flushed with a normal handle using an electric water valve, or with an electronic wall mounted switch. The second version is a macerator toilet-also with either a toilet mounted handle or wall mounted switch. The macerator toilet can be either down drop or through wall drain. It has a stainless multi knife grinder and can pump up to 90ft. I got a cost of around $900.00 for it. Probably the toilet I will have to use. Good Luck, TomC
Having read Dallas' posts over the past couple years, I doubt he meant all that to be taken so literally. It's just his way. He likes to overstate for dramatic effect, so I say easy on him. He's been around a long time and people generally understand his way of writing.
TomC, look at the Dometic Sealand Opus in the high end conversion just a exact copy of the Mircophor that has been around for years that have had the same features you are talking about for years
I have no idea where you come up with the industrial look unless you are looking at their commercial line
good luck
Just because something is used in high end RV's does not mean it is better. I tend to go with the KISS thing here (although some may not like the reference in relation to toilets). Gravity is just such a wonderful blessing, and it is free. It just seems like ingratitude not to use it.
Lin, you get what you pay for if the RV style works for you good I just don't like the pedal valve you know like the different ice cream flavors thing, and the high end rv comment was for TomC and his Sealand
Clifford, you do get what you pay for, and I don't mean to say that I do not appreciate luxuries that may be more complex than the basic. If I go to a hotel, I think that the remote contolled, automatic electric curtains are cool. However, I would not install such a thing at home where I might have to be responsible for fixing them. This hobby has enough maintenance without building in some more. But, of course, I am a bit lazy.
I have been using a $300 Kohler low profile house toilet in my bus for 10 years and love it. I like it so much I bought two more for my new house.
Quote from: Just Dallas on October 01, 2011, 06:06:43 AM
I think you will find hidden in the rules of many campgrounds statements that allow them to charge you for any damage you cause.
It just like causing damage at a motel, if you tear up the room or steal the television, you will be charged for it. If you leave water running in a motel room, and plug the drains up, they can and usually will charge you for the damage.
Besides, these aren't my rules, I am only required to enforce them, although I can't say that I disagree with this particular rule. I was merely trying to inform you and others what the consequences of your actions could be.
So, what are the rules exactly?.
do you mean in general, (
I think you will find hidden in the rules of many campgrounds statements that allow them to charge you for any damage you cause.) or the rules that I have to follow? (
Besides, these aren't my rules, I am only required to enforce them, although I can't say that I disagree with this particular rule.)
Every business has rules in place to try to protect itself from damage caused by customers. In the case of campgrounds, RV parks, Motels, Hotels, Hostels, etc., you are at the mercy of not only the proprietor, but also the state or province where you are.
For instance, about a year and a half ago we had a lady staying here with her 40' 25 year old fifth wheel camper. It looked good on the outside, but had been badly abused on the infrastructure during it's life. She left for a week or two to go home, (she was a welder on the local gas pipeline), but left her camper. She also neglected to turn the water off to the camper. The house toilet she had installed in place of the RV toilet poured water into the septic tank, along with 20 other users who dumped their holding tanks into the same Septic over the same period numerous times.
This flooded the septic tank and the field, requiring a pump out and having the field opened and sucked out also.
If it was your campground, would you have charged her for it, or would you have eaten the charges?
This happens, or something like it, at least 5 times a year. At that rate, that's $4250.
What you may not understand is that smaller campgrounds, like ours that aren't 'Destination' parks, don't make loads of money, contrary to popular belief. We can only charge what the traffic will bear. Would I like to charge more to spread the costs of pump outs among everyone? Sure, but then the price of a spot would be way out of line with all the other campgrounds within 300 miles.
We charge $27/night for a full hookup, (water, sewer, garbage, pool, 20/30/50 electric and wifi), monthly is $325 plus .13¢KwH.
Taxes on this place have been running $16,000/year.
Many campers love to run their A/C 24/7 and keep it meat locker cold in their campers because WE pay the bills! (Electric costs us .11¢/KwH and I've seen campers use 23 KwH in a 24 hour period). In the winter, campers like to use space heaters to warm a piece of junk $6,000 camper warm.
Maybe I am too critical, maybe I'm too harsh, maybe... but I don't own this place. My bosses require me to follow certain rules that require me to make our guests follow certain rules. How would you feel if you parked over night and were told you couldn't dump because the RV parked next to you flooded the tanks because of a faulty flapper valve? Would you feel that you got your money's worth by stopping at this campground?
For those of you that I'm being nasty or critical, think of it this way, a campground is a business, if it doesn't make a profit it won't be in business. If the cost of your stupidity is more than the cost of your site, you pay for it. It's an easy learning curve.
Most of the time, this never ever comes up. That's because most people have the intelligence to monitor their actions. If you won't stop here because you might get charged for causing damage, or if I seem abrasive, I'm sorry for your loss.
Yup, I'm "Just Dallas". I am on this earth to please me.. not you. It pleases me to tell the truth about campgrounds, RV parks, Motels, Hotels and Hostels. If you don't like the rules, please pass on by. I get enough everyday that pitch a bitch about things like having to have a password to use the wifi. If you think our rules are stiff, ask at your favorite resort destination about what they will charge you for if you cause damage.
Or, if you want to go to a campground and drink way too much, (My favorite sport), and let you grubby urchins run wild, starting fires or playing "nail the tail to the poodle", please pass on by. Those are actual occurrences here, and probably at every other campground you've been to.
Good luck to every one of you.
Quote from: pipopak on October 01, 2011, 11:27:59 AM
Quote from: Just Dallas on October 01, 2011, 06:06:43 AM
I think you will find hidden in the rules of many campgrounds statements that allow them to charge you for any damage you cause.
It just like causing damage at a motel, if you tear up the room or steal the television, you will be charged for it. If you leave water running in a motel room, and plug the drains up, they can and usually will charge you for the damage.
Besides, these aren't my rules, I am only required to enforce them, although I can't say that I disagree with this particular rule. I was merely trying to inform you and others what the consequences of your actions could be.
So, what are the rules exactly?.
I've been considering adding a valve to my home drain line. I want it to track and weigh toilet output. Such will be tweeted. Perhaps posted to Facebook. Gotta keep up with the Joneses. Maybe such a valve would be useful in a campground. I guess I should patent, manufacture, and market. With any luck someone already has.
;D
-jbn
A couple of points for Dallas.
1. RV or marine toilets are just as susceptible to bad valves and leaking as are home toilets. I've had the foot pedal stick on mine.
2. It seems to me that your campground waste system is completely inadequate. If one leaky toilet can overwhelm the system, something is wrong. If they are spending $4k a year in pump outs, perhaps it would be better to invest that money in the system capacity.
3. I'm guessing you could not handle a bus rally where 10 or 15 people dump their 100-150 gallon tanks at the same time.
Quote from: Len Silva on October 01, 2011, 01:48:11 PM
A couple of points for Dallas.
1. RV or marine toilets are just as susceptible to bad valves and leaking as are home toilets. I've had the foot pedal stick on mine.
2. It seems to me that your campground waste system is completely inadequate. If one leaky toilet can overwhelm the system, something is wrong. If they are spending $4k a year in pump outs, perhaps it would be better to invest that money in the system capacity.
3. I'm guessing you could not handle a bus rally where 10 or 15 people dump their 100-150 gallon tanks at the same time.
I agree with this, and also think that Dallas, as a manager, should see us as customers, not a bunch of irresponsible old geezers that go to his camp to upset his life. If your campground is inadequate is not our fault.
But I think that he is talking about "irresponsible old (and young) geezers." He is not saying that dumping your 100 gallon tank is a problem, but rather leaving water run down the drain is. It is unfortunate that your faulty valve ended up costing you money, but why would you expect someone else to pay for the damage you caused.
Dallas, I expect a free pass on the pump out fee for supporting your cause.
Quote from: Just Dallas on October 01, 2011, 12:43:50 PM
"Every business has rules in place to try to protect itself from damage caused by customers"
Agree 100% with this.
"In the case of campgrounds, RV parks, Motels, Hotels, Hostels, etc., you are at the mercy of not only the proprietor, but also the state or province where you are."
If you want returning customers you better be merciful.
"For instance, about a year and a half ago we had a lady staying here with her 40' 25 year old fifth wheel camper. It looked good on the outside, but had been badly abused on the infrastructure during it's life. She left for a week or two to go home, (she was a welder on the local gas pipeline), but left her camper. She also neglected to turn the water off to the camper. The house toilet she had installed in place of the RV toilet poured water into the septic tank, along with 20 other users who dumped their holding tanks into the same Septic over the same period numerous times."
You are going to find those characters everywhere, not just at your park. It's part of the fun. Also the 20 users, were they bringing in stuff to "make your day"?.
"This flooded the septic tank and the field, requiring a pump out and having the field opened and sucked out also.
If it was your campground, would you have charged her for it, or would you have eaten the charges?
This happens, or something like it, at least 5 times a year. At that rate, that's $4250."
Looks like either you have a problem with the system, either design or maintenance.
"What you may not understand is that smaller campgrounds, like ours that aren't 'Destination' parks, don't make loads of money, contrary to popular belief. We can only charge what the traffic will bear. Would I like to charge more to spread the costs of pump outs among everyone? Sure, but then the price of a spot would be way out of line with all the other campgrounds within 300 miles."
If you do not charge accordingly with your expenses you will go belly up.
"We charge $27/night for a full hookup, (water, sewer, garbage, pool, 20/30/50 electric and wifi), monthly is $325 plus .13¢KwH.
Taxes on this place have been running $16,000/year.
Many campers love to run their A/C 24/7 and keep it meat locker cold in their campers because WE pay the bills! (Electric costs us .11¢/KwH and I've seen campers use 23 KwH in a 24 hour period). In the winter, campers like to use space heaters to warm a piece of junk $6,000 camper warm."
As you make 2 cents per KwH over your cost, the more they spend the more you make. Am I missing something?.
"Maybe I am too critical, maybe I'm too harsh, maybe... but I don't own this place. My bosses require me to follow certain rules that require me to make our guests follow certain rules. How would you feel if you parked over night and were told you couldn't dump because the RV parked next to you flooded the tanks because of a faulty flapper valve? Would you feel that you got your money's worth by stopping at this campground?
For those of you that I'm being nasty or critical, think of it this way, a campground is a business, if it doesn't make a profit it won't be in business. If the cost of your stupidity is more than the cost of your site, you pay for it. It's an easy learning curve."
Customer service, like managing, is more like fine art. You have it or you do not.
"Most of the time, this never ever comes up. That's because most people have the intelligence to monitor their actions."
Then do not scare them away.
"if I seem abrasive, I'm sorry for your loss."
Got it right, buddy.
"I am on this earth to please me.. not you."
Keep the attitude and you will have plenty of time to pursuit this and your other hobby described below.
Or, if you want to go to a campground and drink way too much, (My favorite sport), and let you grubby urchins run wild, starting fires or playing "nail the tail to the poodle", please pass on by. Those are actual occurrences here, and probably at every other campground you've been to.
Good luck to every one of you.
Here's what we do... We only run off water in our fresh tank. When we get low, we fill back up. We never use city water, therefore no chance of an endless flow of water doing that kind of damage (and no chance of too high water pressure blowing anything out). Doing this also keeps the water in the tank from getting old.
Wow.....Wal-Mart parking lot sounds better every minute. LOL
Point #1: RV and marine toilets DO leak, no question about that, but normally at a much lower rate (GPH) than a house toilet. House toilets are built to fill quickly and shut off, as opposed to an RV or MArine toilet which is built to only flow to wash the effluent down the tube.
Point #2: The park's septic system is more than adequate. Unless you consider 6 500 gallon tanks and 2 1500 gallon tanks inadequate for 32 spaces, a bath house and a laundry. If you didn't know, a 1/2" water line with
normal pressure of 60 psi can flow over 800 gallons per hour. That's not an inconsequential amount considering the user may not be home for 12 to 16 hours.
Point #3: We've had two rallies here, with 12 to 16 coaches, most of whom dumped at some point.
The problem isn't with the systems, the problem is with campers that have absolutely no idea what they are doing and expect the park owner to pay for their stupidity.
As for Pipopak's comment,
Quote from: pipopak on October 01, 2011, 02:33:23 PM
I agree with this, and also think that Dallas, as a manager, should see us as customers, not a bunch of irresponsible old geezers that go to his camp to upset his life. If your campground is inadequate is not our fault.
we do see you as customers, but on the other hand you have to see the park as a viable business that provides a service to you. We do our best to make your stay pleasant and will go out of our way to keep it that way.
Would you prefer that we allow the drunk party next to you to continue on into the night? How about the barking dog that barks for hours and hours and hours? Should we let the owner of the dog to continue to ignore it?
If some one happens to overload the main breaker at the breaker panel in his/her camper causing a fire, which in turn burns down RV's on either side of him, should we not attempt to stop the fire before it gets out of control?
You seem to only to see this from the consumer side of the equation. You also seem to fail to understand that if the park doesn't make a profit, there won't be a park for you to stop and relax at. Not just our park, but any commercial RV park.
I'm not certain what you do for a living, but consider this: If you were in business as a photography shop in a strip mall that you owned and the business next to you started a fire by using a poorly wired electric heater, who would you expect to have to pay for your loss? Your insurance? The next door businesses insurance? The owner of the next door business? Or would you expect to pay for your losses out of your own pocket?
A fundamental rule of a business is that it is there to make a profit. Businesses that don't make a profit don't remain businesses for very long. When taxes on commercial property are raised, who pays for it? The owner? Hee hee, not for very long... he passes his costs onto the consumer.
When your local beanery has their costs raised, do the absorb the increase? Maybe, for a short while, but rest assured, they will be raising their prices or cutting their serving sizes.
In a perfect world, this wouldn't be so, but the world ain't, and this is. Drat the luck!
Quote from: Len Silva on October 01, 2011, 01:48:11 PM
A couple of points for Dallas.
1. RV or marine toilets are just as susceptible to bad valves and leaking as are home toilets. I've had the foot pedal stick on mine.
2. It seems to me that your campground waste system is completely inadequate. If one leaky toilet can overwhelm the system, something is wrong. If they are spending $4k a year in pump outs, perhaps it would be better to invest that money in the system capacity.
3. I'm guessing you could not handle a bus rally where 10 or 15 people dump their 100-150 gallon tanks at the same time.
Quote from: Just Dallas on October 01, 2011, 12:43:50 PM
or playing "nail the tail to the poodle",
Dallas,
I'm probably going to be sorry I asked but what is that? Please describe in language suitable for mixed company. :o :o
BTW, if Phyllis & I ever get down there I am going to dump BOTH tanks at once. You can sue me! Bill my estate! I'm probably worth at least $32.60 now! ;D ;D
TOM
Well I'll be a Long time getting 785 posts but I'm just Don....
and I have been full timing in my coach for 7 years ( my houses and properties are leased out)....Been to Mexico, Alaska,AZ MN ID,AR,FL,NM,MT and LOTS of Texas and I will say Texas has the worst "perk' soil conditions of anyplace probably on earth at least American earth....But I have never seen a rule that said how much i could dump, in fact I recently had (oh MY) a sewage spill...the camp staff came and cleaned it up,replaced my hose and gave me a sewer donut seal that i did not know I was required by LAW to have.
I have read every piece of paper i ever signed for space rent and never have I seen one that said the stuff you express.
Now i will say that once my grandson was filling the toilet and the fill stuck open and overflowed in my coach....we sent his carcass to the taxidermist...because his mother wasn't there to mop up the water.
If your septic worked proper raw water should flow out to your drain field and NOT overflow your tanks to the point of having them pumped, that's just the way it's supposed to work.
PS it's against Texas Law to charge a premium for electricity,
as IT is in most states, you can charge a reading fee..but that is usually regulated to fair market value..like maybe 40$ an hour...32 spaces...about $20.00.....
Where are you at in TX.
PS I already know.
[/quote]
I'm probably worth at least $32.60 now!
TOM
[/quote]
MONEY!!!!. (Rumbling noise of lawyer's stampede heading your way)
FWIW the avg household uses 80 gallons of water per person per day.
IF you are catering to monthly clients and not casual campers then you should be rated for that fact.
I know that every county in Texas has an as-built of every thing that is ever constructed, so either your system will process 2560 gal minimum per day or it is in violation of your permit....
Maybe the engineer did not calculate full-timers in his plan...
And you get stuck implementing a rock and a hard spot POS.situation.
But if thats what you do then thats what you gotta do.
Quote from: Just Dallas on October 01, 2011, 05:59:05 PM
Point #2: The park's septic system is more than adequate. Unless you consider 6 500 gallon tanks and 2 1500 gallon tanks inadequate for 32 spaces, a bath house and a laundry. If you didn't know, a 1/2" water line with normal pressure of 60 psi can flow over 800 gallons per hour. That's not an inconsequential amount considering the user may not be home for 12 to 16 hours.
Don, we are only charging what the legal limit is for the electricity. I can supply the relevant nomenclature from the appropriate bureau if you would like, but I would prefer not to.. I would have to set up the scanner for my laptop which is my main internet interface at this time.
You are also right that Texas has the worst Perk conditions I've ever seen. Growing up in Idaho, We never ever ever had our tanks pumped. However, where we are now, is about mid point on "iron hill", a sub surface formation of iron ore and crustacean layering that happened around 65 million years ago. (I may be wrong on that, I got the time line from Nat Geo).
We also will clean up any spill you have.. no charge, and we will even let you move to a new spot if you aren't happy with the one you have. We also don't have a rule about how much you can dump. Maybe you didn't read my posts?
Your statement
QuoteI have read every piece of paper i ever signed for space rent and never have I seen one that said the stuff you express.
probably didn't dawn on you that somewhere in the rules or statement, it said, "I also agree to be bound by the rules and requirements of this campground".
Reading what you sign doesn't always free you from responsibility.
Again, I'm not trying to be confrontational, but if you insist on doing silly things, you will pay for them, no matter how nice the managers or owners are.
Quote from: eagle19952 on October 01, 2011, 07:13:12 PM
Well I'll be a Long time getting 785 posts but I'm just Don....
and I have been full timing in my coach for 7 years ( my houses and properties are leased out)....Been to Mexico, Alaska,AZ MN ID,AR,FL,NM,MT and LOTS of Texas and I will say Texas has the worst "perk' soil conditions of anyplace probably on earth at least American earth....But I have never seen a rule that said how much i could dump, in fact I recently had (oh MY) a sewage spill...the camp staff came and cleaned it up,replaced my hose and gave me a sewer donut seal that i did not know I was required by LAW to have.
I have read every piece of paper i ever signed for space rent and never have I seen one that said the stuff you express.
Now i will say that once my grandson was filling the toilet and the fill stuck open and overflowed in my coach....we sent his carcass to the taxidermist...because his mother wasn't there to mop up the water.
If your septic worked proper raw water should flow out to your drain field and NOT overflow your tanks to the point of having them pumped, that's just the way it's supposed to work.
PS it's against Texas Law to charge a premium for electricity,
as IT is in most states, you can charge a reading fee..but that is usually regulated to fair market value..like maybe 40$ an hour...32 spaces...about $20.00.....
Where are you at in TX.
PS I already know.
I also agree to be bound by the rules and requirements of this campground".
I can understand this BUT IF it isn't written AND made available then it ain't gonna wash.
where I am now (for instance) they have a no clothes washer/dryer policy yet a "blind eye" has been turned for years ( apparently), all i am sayin is if you bend one rule....you will end up allowing them all to be bent in court.
Usually in these parks there is a clic type life view and most of the clics don't "like' the owners...not necasary the manager.....
PS I am not confronting neither.
It actually doesn't have to be written anywhere. As soon as you enter private property, you have agreed to their rules and regulations. That's merely the rule of the land, not a Texas rule or any other state rule.
I'm not really sure I could be at your campground... If I want to wash clothes, I don't want to be naked to do it.... I couldn't stand the laughter and derision.
Quote from: eagle19952 on October 01, 2011, 09:40:02 PM
I also agree to be bound by the rules and requirements of this campground".
I can understand this BUT IF it isn't written AND made available then it ain't gonna wash.
where I am now (for instance) they have a no clothes washer/dryer policy yet a "blind eye" has been turned for years ( apparently), all i am sayin is if you bend one rule....you will end up allowing them all to be bent in court.
Usually in these parks there is a clic type life view and most of the clics don't "like' the owners...not necasary the manager.....
PS I am not confronting neither.
I have the RV toilet for connivance. Both of simplicity of winterising ,operation,and installation. Bob
Went to the Microphor site again and looked at the RV toilets. Still the same opinion-they look like a bus or train commercial toilet. Far to industrial looking for me.
Dometic makes the same 100% porcelain toilet in either gravity or macerator-far nicer looking of a toilet. Good Luck, TomC
Dallas,
I hadn't considered the drainage conditions there. In Florida, it's just about impossible to overwhelm a properly functioning drain field.
Quote from: Len Silva on October 02, 2011, 09:41:57 AM
In Florida, it's just about impossible to overwhelm a properly functioning drain field.
Not impossible, just takes a dedicated idiot.
I thought that was why Texas was so big-- they needed the room for the leach fields.
Nope Lin, they need the room to handle the egos of some of the people here.
Quote from: Lin on October 02, 2011, 10:06:56 AM
I thought that was why Texas was so big-- they needed the room for the leach fields.
Len, our drainage is almost non-existent. We live on a formation called Iron Hill, it's between 5 and 50 feet down, composed of iron ore, shale, sedimentary rock, igneous rock and shallow sea fossils. (As an aside, we even have some fossilized shells that the native Americans made a blue dye from. It's reputed to be almost identical to the dye used by the Hebrews in the old testament). The layer stretches for 50 miles out into the gulf, up to the Red river, south to Mexico, and west to the other side of Waco. Sometimes 200' thick, sometimes only a few inches. Above that is a layer of clay that is excellent for making pottery with. That extends way up into Oklahoma and way south into central Mexico.
Right where we are the clay comes within 8" of the surface in most places. Believe me, digging trenches for new power posts, electrical conduit, and water lines took 4 people 4 weeks to go 18" down and 300 feet long. Couldn't use a trencher because of sewer lines, gas pipelines, oil pipelines, trunked electrical, (Not sure what that is, but they say it carries over 100,000 V) and some other stuff that has easements across the property.
The perking factor takes so long that they don't measure in hours or even days..... we can count on a month or more to perk 50 gallons.
New systems are Aerobic, but we can't use those here because of the campers that may walk their precious puppies and children, so we are stuck with the older Anaerobic systems.
We actually have enough room to put in 50-75 more spaces, but due to the limitations of the septic systems, we couldn't handle that many.
If I came across as combative to anyone here, I apologize. My intention was only to inform and educate. I realize that my manner may be somewhat abrupt and irritable, but I was taught by the best... none of whom would spare the feelings if a good whack with the Crescent wrench would do.
Quote from: Len Silva on October 02, 2011, 09:41:57 AM
Dallas,
I hadn't considered the drainage conditions there. In Florida, it's just about impossible to overwhelm a properly functioning drain field.
none of whom would spare the feelings if a good whack with the Crescent wrench would do. ...........so did your grandfather come from the same place mine did...Newfoundland... :-\