We were ready to go home yesterday and the the starter wouldn't turn. I ohmed out the wiring and I was getting 12v to the solenoid. I banged on the solenoid with a hammer and the bus started right up. I drove 100 miles and the same thing. We spent the night at a stop and I rewired the circuit and she started without the hammer.
We then made our last fuel stop in San Antonio and no start. This time it took several tries with the hammer to get her to go. We are now at home, the bus is tucked in her parking spot, and she won't start.
Can I just replace the solenoid? Or do I have to replace the whole starter?
David
David,
The last time I had starter problems I could hear the solenoid "clicking in" so I didn't change the entire unit, just the solenoid, and it fixed the problem. Don't know what type of bus you have, I had a 4905, the hardest part of the job was getting to the starter.
Couple of the best nights of RVing we ever had was at Diamond Lake in November. Literally had the entire lake to ourselves.
Good luck with the starter.
David, probably not the solenoid but you can jump from the 12 volt battery terminal on the starter down to the small terminal on bottom of the solenoid if it starts the solenoid is bad or your low voltage or starter relay is bad,Texas Industrial Electric in San Antonio sells the Delco solenoid for about 50 bucks not a knock off replacement
If the starter is bad I recommend you buy a Delco MT 39 from Blanchard it will be new with the solenoid just going to cost you a little more than rebuilding your old Delco 42 no core charge either and not a heavy sucker like your 42 lol
good luck
The start relay in the wiring panel is clicking hard and seems ok. I have 12v at the solenoid on the starter when the button is pushed and I replaced the ground wire. It wouldn't restart this afternoon when I got home. I'll jump from 12v at the battery to the 12v+ terminal on the starter solenoid tomorrow or Monday to see if it turns. If it does, it's wiring or the relay. If not it's the solenoid.
David
Quote from: David Anderson on September 10, 2011, 07:41:48 PM. . . I'll jump from 12v at the battery to the 12v+ terminal on the starter solenoid tomorrow or Monday to see if it turns. If it does, it's wiring or the relay. If not it's the solenoid.
Or the long shot - an intermittent open on the solenoid coil's ground side.
Ted
[/quote]
Or the long shot - an intermittent open on the solenoid coil's ground side.
Ted
[/quote]I rewired that side.
Ok, I jumped 12v from the battery to the 12+ side of the solenoid coil. It just sparked like a short circuit and would not engage the starter, so it's solenoid removal time.
There are four bolts holding the solenoid body on the starter housing. Do I just disconnect the battery cabling, jumper lug from load side of coil to starter, and the 4 mounting bolts to get this device off? Any gears in there to the starter? In the picture above it sure looks like something mechanical is in the body of that solenoid. Give me some advice before I mess up something.
In the picture you can see where I dinged it up rapping it with the hammer. I'm sure glad my hammer got us home.
David
I had a similar problem on my Dodge/Cummins pickup. It would not start unless I smacked the solenoid with a hammer, then it would start every time. Had to be the solenoid, right? No, it was the starter as I found out after a lot of extra work replacing the solenoid.
When you remove the starter hook 12 volts up to the starter past the solenoid if it doesn't spin then it is starter time you probably have broken brush holders.
That is a heavy joker do you have a floor jack
good luck
Quote from: luvrbus on September 11, 2011, 02:27:04 PM
When you remove the starter hook 12 volts up to the starter past the solenoid if it doesn't spin then it is starter time you probably have broken brush holders.
That is a heavy joker do you have a floor jack
good luck
So you think I need to remove the starter and not just the solenoid? I can hook a jumper cable directly to the 12v+ bolt on the starter and 12v+ off the battery to see if the starter spins. Beats using a screwdriver to jump the terminals :o
Quote from: David Anderson on September 11, 2011, 02:07:39 PM
Ok, I jumped 12v from the battery to the 12+ side of the solenoid coil. It just sparked like a short circuit and would not engage the starter, so it's solenoid removal time. . . .
Could be an issue with the plunger, linkage, or drive.
The coil is a simple electro-mag, if it's sparking it's probably okay and magnetizing the "hole" but for some reason the plunger is not able to pull in. The plunger has to be pulled in by magnetism to engage the drive and close the main switch contacts.
Pull the solenoid first if it's easy to access, then check for smooth free plunger and linkage operation.
If it's tight quarters working on the solenoid, then pull the whole starter assembly.
Ted
You need to remove the starter if for nothing else a good cleaning with holders, brushes and bushing replacement not a major deal have you replaced the starter in the years you owned the Eagle ? that is a older style 42 Mt starter and solenoid you have there
good luck
If it was me (for what it's worth) I'd remove the entire unit and take it to a truck or heavy electrical shop and have the entire unit tested and they will tell you what needs fixing, instead of trying to guess.
Before you spend any money on it though give Clifford's advice some serious consideration. MT39s are not expensive and they are MUCH more pleasant to deal with. In my limited experience they are also infinitely more reliable.
Sure, swapping the complete starter will probably fix it, but myself, when possible, I like a postmortem that pinpoints failure before changing out parts.
Ted
Quote from: luvrbus on September 11, 2011, 02:48:49 PM
You need to remove the starter if for nothing else a good cleaning with holders, brushes and bushing replacement not a major deal have you replaced the starter in the years you owned the Eagle ? that is a older style 42 Mt starter and solenoid you have there
good luck
No, I have never had to do a thing to in the 11 years of ownership. I got the starter off today. The solenoid has a cracked cover at the load side of one of the big battery cable terminals. It also had a funky smell like burned insulation. Man I'm glad all my OEM AC stuff is gone. It would have been a nightmare to remove this from underneath the bus.
I think it would be wise to replace the whole thing. I don't like to get stranded out on a trip. What should I expect to pay for a new MT39?
David
$378.44 all taxes in, 2 years ago at Blanchards in Seattle. I didn't have a core but I can't see where that would have made any difference on the invoice.
You can buy the Japan made 39mt forgot the manufacture for 240 bucks at Blanchard but I think he has a core charge on that one the Delco is the better starter like Bob bought,
FWIW I never cared for that stater till I installed one with 1 hand LOL.
They don't draw any amps starting David if I remember right the solenoid only draws 4 amps under a load
good luck
There are a bunch on Ebay from $100 to $299. How do I know which 39mt fits my DD 6v92?
clockwise or counterclockwise?
http://motors.shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=delco+starter+mt+39&_sacat=&_dmpt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&_odkw=delco+starter&_osacat=0&bkBtn=&_trksid=p4506.m270.l1313 (http://motors.shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=delco+starter+mt+39&_sacat=&_dmpt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&_odkw=delco+starter&_osacat=0&bkBtn=&_trksid=p4506.m270.l1313)
Clifford,
I thought you were not fond of the 39mt's from the way you talked about them. I guess things do change huh?
;D BK ;D
BK, they are better now so many on the market now you can get parts for one,age makes a difference also those 42's were getting heavy for this old guy lol and I figured if Bob could lift a 39MT it should be ok for me and they are nice to install just joking Bob
good luck
Can we get one for a wrong turning 6v92 for my GM
uncle ned
one old person
I did some calling. Seems I have a 40 MT 11 tooth starter, clockwise rotation. TX Industrial in San Antonio has a copy cat version of the Delco 39 MT for $385+tax. The Delco brand is $575. The salesman said they have had good service from the off brands that they sell. However, if I wanted the Delco they will gladly sell me one.
Looks like the high $300's is about what I should expect.
David
David, call Blanchard I think he will beat that price of 575.00 on a Delco starter
good luck
Dave if that "copy cat" is a Mitsubishi you might want to consider it anyway. I can't remember who told me but somebody whose opinion I respected told me they were a better starter than the Delco. My first MT39 was a Mitsubishi and it never gave a moment of trouble - after 4 years of use I just wanted to have a spare. The Delco definitely has a larger frame than the Mitsubishi and in general I prefer more metal to less but I did have really good service out of mine. Its wrapped up in a bay right now waiting for the day when the Delco won't start the frenchy-bus.
Bob, the Mitsubishi really doesn't fit the 92 series very good from what I see the nose cone is a little different than a Delco
good luck
Dammitall Clifford that was a lot of work and now I have to go back and wrap the SOB up again for storage. I just went and took a picture of whatever I have for a spare starter. I think its a Mitsubishi but I can't remember who told me that's what it is. All I can see on it is a decal from my terrorist rebuilders in Saskatoon, Karam Automotive. I do know for sure that it was hanging on my 8-92 for 4+ years with nary a hiccup the whole time.
(on edit)
As this was uploading I remembered that when I first hung it on the frenchy-bus it would lock up solid. The nosecone looked like the 42 that I took off and it bolted up OK but something was slightly different. I took it back to the terrorists and they changed the nosecone. I assumed it was just a different alignment or cone but maybe it was deeper than that.
(now I'll go outside and bow deeply three times while facing Mojave Valley - and then I'll wrap the starter up and put it away again)
Looks like a Nippon Denco to me Bob
good luck
I put the new starter in. It was much easier to install than remove. The guy that sold it to me has a rebuild shop in San Antonio. He said he has had good service from these. It was $350 out the door. It spins much faster than the old one. He told me my old starter was a 40 Mt.