I have a 50amp system. I was wondering if I could buy an inverter out of an old salvage rv. I know I could not run the whole bus but could I put a plug on it to accept my coach plug so I could run heaters and a TV at night to keep from running my genny all night. Or for driving somewhere and run an ac and TV with the fridge. I guess I am asking is there a simple install or is a big undertaking to wire it all in. I am hoping it is plug and play. I leave for the NASCAR race at Texas motor speedway next weekend and for what 100 hours of running the genny cost me I could buy some batteries and inverter. If it is to big of a job then I will wait on spending the money and have it ready for the spring race.
What kind of heaters are you using? Electric or propane? Do you have a line on a specific inverter, or are you asking in general. Any chance you mean a converter? A lot of different answers are possible. If your inverter needs to be wired into your electrical panel, that adds quite a number of steps.
Glenn
I have electric heater. I do not have a line on one. I guess i am asking about an inverter but from reading I guess campers have converters. So let me ask this. If I buy a 3000w inverter ( http://houston.craigslist.org/tls/2005890707.html (http://houston.craigslist.org/tls/2005890707.html) ) can I wirer a plug on it to power the house but just use a few items?
Quote from: eddiepotts on October 30, 2010, 01:32:56 PM
I have electric heater. .......... can I wirer a plug on it to power the house but just use a few items?
Like a lot of questions that get asked here the answer is "Yes, but ......"
There ain't no free lunch. You need a basic understanding of watts before you go too far down this road.
Poop sheets (http://www.phrannie.org/phredex.html) is a good place to start. Read #2 & #5 then come back and ask the question again. Others much wiser than me will no doubt hop onboard with other resources.
caution---if you run it off your start batteries (when parked) you might not have enough power to start bus. also ck see if it is 3000 continuous or surge power with 2000 continuous.
Eddie,
Inverters are an essential part of an integrated electrical system and can't usually be put together ad-hoc. I would say the same thing about a heating system. Do you only use the coach for tailgating? I think we could help you out with a nice design once we know more about your plans. It is possible to run a roof air (or 2) while travelling down the road if you have enough charging power and a big enough inverter. Tell us about your coach as well. We look forward to helping!
Glenn
I do use it for tailgating. It is an entertainer so I just need to run 1 ac while driving. I have a slide door that shuts the front lounge off so not much space to keep cool. I have a 24v system with a 65a alternator. I won't use the start batteries. I plan to buy 2 deep cycles for this. I don't have room for a large battery bank and It does not have to last me all day. I just want something to turn some lights on at night and when we sleep I can have enough heat to take the chill out. I can add a 12v alternator to charge the aux batteries while driving and was thinking a switch that would charge if genny was running or a simple battery charger. I just hate running the genny if someone wants a light to read with or watch TV while I am driving. I have a small bar fridge that I have to keep cold also. I am wanting something I can just plug in and not have a major rewire job. Cold here is 45* so I don't need much heat. I want things down to the basics. I don't mind not being able to run the ac and the microwave at the same time.
The picture in your file looks like a prevost. Is that your bus? I would think that a prevost would have a much larger 24v alternator. Usually a 50DN. Those put out around 250a. If you don't have it anymore, you could do better with another 24v alternator tied in with your existing one. That would allow you to run a large enough inverter (around 2000a or more) to run a roof air while driving down the road. As for heat, electric won't work very well. They need a big battery bank. Does your coach only have the engine heat? Do you only have 120AC lighting? Do you have a propane system? Tell us more.
Glenn
A 3000 watt continuous inverter is big enough to run an AC or heater plus some light stuff. You could wire it so that you plug your shore cord into it also if you use the proper gauge wire and the right receptacle. Where the power is coming from is the big question. If you get a 24v inverter, it can do the job, but your 65a alternator will not. If you get a 12v inverter and want to run AC on the road, you will probably need at least a 200 amp, 12v alternator. I am just using approximates here, but as Bob said, there is no free lunch. Running a couple of reading lights is easy. Running hear and AC is serious. Since an average electric heater will use something like 125 amps, you will need a good battery bank to support it. Also, even if you wire the coach cord to connect to the inverter through a plug and receptacle, which saves you needing a transfer switch, you will still have to hard wire it to the battery bank with large gauge cable.
If you really want to keep things simple, skip the idea of using the inverter for AC and heat. Just look to cover the small loads.
Yes, the prevost is mine. it's an 83. The 50dn is gone. The bus is all 120ac lights. The 2 24v alternators sound good. Are you saying inverters come in 24v? I do have an automatic switch that changes from shore power to generator. How big of a battery bank would we be talking to run an ac and flat panel TV for 10hrs. Just for an idea. I have a roof top ac.
Ed..don't think it is possible to do 10 hrs..I have heard even the large batt banks just do a ac for a very short time..that's with the 24volt several thousand dollar units. then you get into the fact that some items won't run off modified sine wave--and need the more expensive pure sine wave units..the high tech guys can put numbers to it..I don't think a 3000 unit has enough surge power to start a ac unit..Bob
Well this is good info. So it sounds like a good cheap one would be the way for me to go just for a light and TV. I just keep hearing the generator uses about a gallon an hour and the thought of $300 in fuel for a few days just gets to me.
I think the biggest hurdle here will be trying to drown out the sound of every one else's Generator at the speed way ::)
maybe a small 1000 watt quiet gen set.low fuel consumption
There's a busnut up here that hated the generator noise, so way back in 1999 or so, he was working on having the capacity to put 16 golf cart batteries under the front in the spare tire compartment of an MC9.
Wired for 24 volts, with the newest/most efficient big name roof air of the day, he was able to keep the rear bedroom cool overnight with 8 batteries installed and some careful power management. A Trace 4024 was the inverter involved, IIRC.
So, you can do lots of things, as long as you are sufficiently committed, and pay the costs!
For tailgating, lights and televisions are easily powered with a modest sized system. Air conditioning, heat and microwaves are big power hogs, but you can fire up the generator to supplement and then shut it off again.
Just some math. Add up your anticipated power consumption, convert your amp hours from the 120 volt for the voltage of the intended battery bank, and then double the size of the battery bank, running batteries less than half kills them quickly.
Yes, you could whip up a system for this race, but I fear your learning curve may not keep up, and you may end up with hardware that won't make you happy moving forward.
Skip it for now, do some research and execute a winner for next race?
happy coaching!
buswarrior
A gallon per hour for the generator?
How big a generator? Entertainer coaches are famous for running overly big generators, but to get that kind of consumption, I'd be thinking it needs to be loaded heavy, pretty much to the max.
And you aren't doing that, so maybe the generator isn't costing what you think it is?
happy coaching!
buswarrior
Could grab a cheap portable Gen and set it on the ground outside and have fun :)
I really feel sorry for the people next to me. But I have slept in everything from a tent to my Prevost out there for the last ten years so it is my turn to make some noise. The rumble of a good engine puts me right to sleep. I don't think I have seen one race without a nap during the middle of it. It may have something to do with the hangover lol.
BW I think your right. I need a couple of flashlights and an Iphone for internet. If she complains it's cold then she needs to move closer. I think I will do some more studying and come up with something I need instead of having to start over later. I just hate not even being able to get a 2500w portable generator to run cheaper. My generator is a 21kw Kabota. It may not be costing me as much as I think. Just going off what I have read here. I seen some marine guages that measures fuel usage for twin engines. I may need to get one.
Van, Yhats what I would like to do. I even have one. It only had 2 110v outlets on it. How do I get me 50amp plug in it.
Depending on the kw of the portable, my guess each outlet would be 15-20 amp max. Hook up to your 50 amp system couldn't help there, I'll let those who have been there advise you cause this is uncharted territory for me ;D adapters maybe? :-\. By the way, a gallon of fuel an hour for a genny sounds pretty steep. What kind of Gen do you have on board, also might look into a portable propane heater like our Big Buddy heater does work well to take the chill out, but not for the entire coach. Don't they have 50 amp at the race way? Las vegas motor speedway even has 100 amp for the high dollar big boys. Oh some 12 volt lighting in key locations about the bus could run pretty much all night with little drain in the juice department, just ask boxcarOkie ;) and your savings... more BEER for the races. ;D
get a set of dogbones, cheater plugs, with your 50 amp on one end, and then a combination of pieces that get you down to 30 amp for campgrounds, and a regular 15 amp for plain plugs. Hardcore, get a 20 amp one too.
I have one of those circular twist plugs on my 3k inverter Yamaha that lets me access all the power. I made up a cord with the circular plug on one end, and a stove plug box on the other for the 50 amp cord.
Powering through a Trace 4024, it will run two roof airs. Don't know for how long under what extremes, but it functions and the batteries get a little dribble of charge while doing it.
And, you can carry on a polite conversation standing over the top of it while it does it.
happy coaching!
buswarrior
Van, TMS does not have power in the infield. I think they have a lot outside the track that has it but I would not give up my spot inside for it. And I think it is high dollar for them anyway. I don't hunt so this is my deer lease. I am starting to think hunting would be cheaper. I am a mechanical inspector for Shell Oil company so when I see what these cars can do mechanically it makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up. It's not who wins for me it is all about the cars. Nobody knows what it is until they are standing against the fence when 43 cars come by at 200mph. It is loud but it does get your heat pumping. ;D
BW, So I can make a 4 wire 50a pigtail to plug into the plugs on a small generator? I know it would just trip the breaker if I overload it. I just want to know that when it gets to the TV it will all be safe power for it. If someone could give me a diagram of how to wire the pigtail that would be great.
Yes, you can... perhaps the assistance of some experienced hands to check the coach would be in order?
Depending on whether you have 240 volt loads on board, and how the rest of it is wired, you might have trouble.
All things being appropriate....
If the little generator is wired for 240, you faithfully connect all 4 wires to the appropriate connections and all should be good.
If the generator is wired for 120, you tie both the hots together in the three wire plug, providing 120V to each side of the panel. No 240v loads will work, but you MUST know that everything in the coach is wired correctly, that you haven't got wires reversed, neutral/ground issues are correct and any other wild things that let loads appear to "work" but may be dangerous, especially if you start adapting things.
Dangerous means fire/electrocution hazard at worst, and non-functioning due to tripping breakers at best.
happy coaching!
buswarrior