I just made an appointment with my "friendly local sand storm maker". ;) It's time to start making my baby look "purty". :) There are as many as 12-13 coats of paint on her and I just can't see adding to it. Plus, there is lots of "lifting in spots, etc. that would need hours and hours of hand work.
I'm going to start taping (duct) this afternoon and then hopefully get it to him tomorrow about noon to blast. He said it should be about $300.00. Helluva deal, I thought. But....that is as long as Murphy doesn't raise his ugly head. :P I'm trying to brace myself for that. I know he will.
I'm only blasting/painting between the bays and up to a foot or so on to the top as I plan to "coat" the top with something (not sure yet) to protect ,and possibly insulate, the top. I bought 2 kits (4 gallons, hope that's enough.) of the Southern Polyurethanes light grey epoxy primer. About as good as you can do for the primer. It's some really good stuff and lays down wonderfully. I'll probably leave it in primer till next summer when I'll make her nice and shiny. I have plenty of "issues" with the body that I need to rectify and this way when I fix a spot, reprime it and it will look reasonably decent. (I too am one who likes to use it as I fix it up.) Plus, the epoxy is more like a semi-gloss that looks pretty good by itself and it's somewhat close to the color I am going to use as the final coat. (A silvery light blue, I think.) The present colors, black and brown, are faded down to look about like flat paint anyway.
Well, wish me luck. I'm CERTAINLY going to need it. It feels like an overwhelmingly daunting undertaking. I'll be taking pix for you who are "voyeur". :D :D :D :D
Stay tuned!
Chaz (just a stressin)
It's gonna look great! You have the right idea and approach! I had at least the same amount of paint on ours and I'm sure I took off a couple hundred pounds of dust! ::) No, not the red stuff, OK! ;D It was black and blue! ;)
I get to redo mine and I'm going with Southern also!
Please post some pics!
Paul
Chaz,
I am going to blast mine too!
After really taking a good look at how much work would be involved in sanding around all those rivets, I
am going to have it media blasted too.
You definitely have the right idea.
Let me know all the struggles so mine will be easier.... ;D
You know I am rooting for Ya!
Cliff
What kind of media, Cliff? I was going to do soda. It sounded good. They will come to you and you don't have to tape ANYTHING and easy clean up. But....... it's a bit "salty" ($$$$$$$) and I've been hearing some bad stories about the effects of the soda on paint if you don't get it clean.
When I had my '56 Chevy blasted they used ground up buttons. Basically, just little plastic pieces. Nice job.
I got the awning off tonite and all but 4 windows pre-taped. It will be a busy morning getting ready!!
Later......
Quote from: Chaz on September 28, 2010, 04:51:18 PM
What kind of media, Cliff? I was going to do soda. It sounded good.
I was thinking of soda too.
I am going to do a little research on costs in my area.
Cliff
I built a dual height scaffold out of some 2x4's in the back of a pickup truck, both heights allowed me to reach the top and midway up on my 4905. Planks for footing. I put aircraft stripper on her, waited awhile, then took it off with a pressure washer (wearing goggles, rubber gloves, etc.). Did the whole coach twice and had a nice smooth bare metal coach, including the roof and around the rivets. She had 3 coats of old paint along the sides.
I then treated it all with phosphoric acid solution to etch it. Taped it up and primed then painted with 2k urethane as used on industrial machinery and commercial vehicles. It was fairly quick, easy, inexpensive (well the paint was a tad expensive), and turned out very nice. Glossy white roof and sides. Later I will add some color in the form of stripes, mural, design or whatever. But for now it is stark white and looks 100% better than the old charter livery. I used an automotive hvlp spray gun and it was a pain re-filling it a lot but no dry spots and quite a nice finish. A pressure pot would be nice to use but I was going for economy and did not want to buy one for one time use.
There was a nice satisfaction in getting to bare metal and doing it myself. if you've already made the appointment for soda blasting it is a bit late for this advice. Maybe it will give another some ideas though.
Andrew.
Chaz,
Pictures, Pictures or an article BCM.
Art
Sounds like you guys have thought about the blasting media.
It is critical from what I can tell. Using sand (and depending on the size and sharpness of the grit) can really do a ton of damage to a sheet metal surface. In the hands of an aggressive blaster, you can warp every panel.
I was taking one of the Bus Conversion week-long conversion class (think 1999) and Mike K had a blaster come out and do a ***Futureliner***. The guy warped every panel and I mean really warped (think an inch or more in places) them. My opinion was that the bus (worth millions if well done) was ruined. I think Mike owned the bus and often wonder what happened to it.
Jim
It is exciting to see it all come together with new paint. Our turned into a LONG ordeal, but, it is done now. ::)
I just painted my MC9; I stripped off about 8 to 14 coats of paint, depending on the area, with paint remover. That miserable water based white on the roof was the worst, but I got off every speck of paint in about five four-hour days (to avoid the direct sun) at a cost of just under $150 for the remover, and no damage. Not really that bad a job, and I'm 65. Hell, the liquor bill was almost as much as the remover :)
Did ya ever feel like ya bit off a little more than a mouthful?? :o ::)
OOOoooooooooooooo..............................................
The old adage my Dad told me years ago rings true here: "A little paint and a lot of bondo hides a multitude of sins."
Wow wow wow.
Oh well, we're in it now. Actually, it doesn't seem quite as bad if you look at the ratio of stuff that needs "fixin" compared to the size of the old girl. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D But, the bad thing is she is "raw" and I need to get her in primer by tomorrow night at 6:00. The aluminum is not so bad but the steel concerns me a bit. ::) And I just HATE deadlines. >:(
But, I have a plan of attack. All the spots that need "fixin" I spot primered today. ( It's VERY highly recommended to shoot the epoxy primer on before any body filler or seam sealer. It sticks, seals and stays better. ) Then in the morning I'm going to hit the holes (not big, just many) with Fibertech by Evercoat. It's kinda like the old "Kitty hair" but supposedly much better. (Better be for what it costs!! :o It's in an over sized tooth paste tube) Then work that down wet and get on all the seams and spots that need personal manicuring and sanding - corners and such. Then re-tape all the stuff that I needed to take off to drive it and shoot it with 2 coats of epoxy. A buddy borrowed me his 2.5 gallon paint pot so I should be able to go to town if it works well.
Here are some pix of what I have now:
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi58.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fg279%2FSkulptor%2FMotor%2520Coach%2FDSC00030.jpg&hash=5edb73427b1664aab57452a7d773f9f438ae4038)
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi58.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fg279%2FSkulptor%2FMotor%2520Coach%2FDSC00029.jpg&hash=f8e8c85d3ee6b73b6450a2a928e2f6ede6ebb57b)
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi58.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fg279%2FSkulptor%2FMotor%2520Coach%2FDSC00041.jpg&hash=b07130e499a34b752e080e5759398c06542c9546)
I got more detail of the bad spots but I didn't think they were that interesting. Just dents and holes. ;D
By the way, I'm not sure as I would recommend blasting. I think it's fine and it seems to have worked out well for me, BUT, it is VERY messy...........VEEEEERY messy. We taped the hell outta things and I still have just short of a beach in the inside. Granted, it can all be cleaned but some wives and even some annal retentive owners would probably have a sh*t hemorrhage over the mess! I have to say, it's even killin me not to get in there and clean but I have a definite deadline I have to make.
I don't think he warped anything too much. Maybe just a little in some bad spots but she was "friendly" (wavy) anyway, but not too bad I don't think. Shiny paint will tell the tale. He did check the panels for straightness before he started so we knew about what we had. Seems OK.
I'd say he put in between 10 and 12 hours blasting her. There were somewhere around 6-8 coats of paint and multiple stripes. There was a pale yellow base coat that was pretty thick and took the most effort to cut off. But figure about that many hours of just blasting. Plus, about another 6-8 taping.
If you do attempt to do this, 2 things come to mind:
1.) prepare yourself for what could be lurking under the paint and possibly bondo. i.e. have someplace to put her in out of the elements or "KNOW" you have enough good weather to get her in primer before moisture. The problems you find under the paint could set your time frame back a bit. It did mine.
2.) Tape, tape, tape, tape, tape......... Then tape some more. Use good THICK duct tape where the blasting comes into contact with things you don't want blasted. Good masking tape elsewhere. I used "Duck Tape" brand duct tape. 3M was too thin. So it doesn't need to be a well known brand name to be a good tape for this. And I would NEVER use Gorilla Tape!!!! That is some bad @$# stuff!! Use that when you want to REEEEEALLY fix something!! It's tuff and VERY sticky!! I also used clear 4 mil. visqueen (spell? - clear plastic) for over the windows and skirt. A 20' x 25' sheet did me.
I'll keep ya all up on the progress but I need to go horizontal for now. I'm pooped and my deadline will be here in no time tomorrow.
g'nite..........
I just finished the paint project. Ain't it funny how much BIGGER the bus looks from behind a paint gun!! LOL Good luck, looks like you got it ready for lots a primer!!
Chaz, I'm about to commit to having the 4107 painted. The current plan is soda blasting. In one of your earlier posts, you'd planned on soda, but you were reconsidering. What did you end up using for blasting media?
Arthur
Arthur,
The guy saved up "used" Black Beauty. He didn't want to use "new" as it's too aggressive. It's a medium that "rounds off" as it's used.
Be VERY careful if you use soda! You have to make sure you wash it ALL off. My painter reiterated that yesterday. And they should NEVER use silica sand. That stuff will kill ya. But like I mentioned when they did my '56 they used ground up plastic buttons. If you have a professional do it, they will know.
Back out to start paintin!!!
Chaz
Just for the record................ I hate rivets. >:(
Back to it.
Damn rain.
This is what yesterday looked like. :-[
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi58.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fg279%2FSkulptor%2FMotor%2520Coach%2FDSC00044.jpg&hash=86fdccc8002280bcef48ef7f4e6dd75528cddf5a)
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi58.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fg279%2FSkulptor%2FMotor%2520Coach%2FDSC00045.jpg&hash=a7bd239fa2ecb95b22924a4d5c762571f951c7ca)
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi58.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fg279%2FSkulptor%2FMotor%2520Coach%2FDSC00046.jpg&hash=d631bee469ef6f51e745af3dcee91b8074112089)
What a drag. You can even see my little buddy Roo was bummin in the picture. He was gettin rained on. ;D
I'm just waitin for it to warm up a bit so I can "skin'er back" and keep going. I think this epoxy is rather forgiving in the "lace curtain" department. (runs) But being cooler out and possibly having a little wind, thus having the gun closer, I imagine I'll probably hang a couple curtains on her. But, being primer and needing to sand it again anyway, it's not a big deal.
I did get a full day of work done on her yesterday................. cleaning!!!
Oh my God!!!!! If you decide to try this at home, well, I'm not sure what to tell ya. All I can say is that stuff finds every crack, seam, hole, etc. to come thru. Hell, I think it comes right thru the metal!!! ;D It was "Black's Beach" without the "skin" in there.(those of you who know what I'm talkin about in So.Cal. ::) ;D)
You can see some of the grey epoxy primer on the picture of the front. Not a bad look itself!! Definitely beats the brown and black turd lookin colors.
Well, time to peel her back and get paintin.............. I hope.
More later......
Chaz
OK, here is what she looks like today:
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi58.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fg279%2FSkulptor%2FMotor%2520Coach%2FDSC00047.jpg&hash=cb7929af45e5f1eefdf444b0054aa84d4d9bf7fe)
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi58.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fg279%2FSkulptor%2FMotor%2520Coach%2FDSC00048.jpg&hash=98184395d92f16f6dc2bf45e82251a1567e9b664)
OK, so I got a bit of a "brown nose". ;D lol!!! I'll take care of that with my sand blast cabinet. (modified fuel oil tank. Works excellent!)
I still have the passenger side to paint but I think I will wait till tomorrow. Too cold today. I wanted to get it done today but I think it best to wait till it warms up tomorrow.
Yesterday was an interesting day to spray..... to say the least. If you watch NASCAR remember when they say how the track changes with sun and clouds?? Man, you should try PAINTING!! It was mid to high 50's yesterday so not the best temp to paint anyway. But, when the sun was out, I coulda painted her with a garden hose and not had runs!! Then, when the sun went behind clouds, I couldn't have sprayed it with a perfume bottle without hangin curtains!! Amazing!!!
So, needless to say, there are a couple little "window treatments" hanging on the side of my bus. ::) ::) ;D ;D But not bad. Good thing is, I'll have to scuff it down before final paint. Bad thing is, I'll have to scuff it down before final paint. :'( ;D I'm not lookin forward to scuffing around all those rivets so I may become very "Fond" of this color!!! ;D Actually, I don't think that color looks too bad!! And it looks OUTSTANDING when I think about scuffing!! (ick. :P)
So there's your update for today. "Good Lord willin and the creek don't rise", I'll have some final shots tomorrow.
Later...............
Here is a shot to show how many coats of paint she had on her:
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I wonder if paint has an insulation value?? ::) ;D LOLOL I know the pic isn't real clear but there is 11 coats there.
If all goes well, she should be all grey today. I may not get the "brown nose" taken care of tho. I think that will be an issue getting that off. Hope not.
I'll start another thread for this but I am interested in finding rivets - I just need a couple - and the rubber gasket around the destination window. It's toast.
More to come......
Chaz
Done!! 6:00 last night. Pfewwww..... Over a solid weeks work. I thought I was better than that. ::)
No pix this round as one side looks like the other. ;D I still have some odds and ends to finish up but that can happen anytime this winter. I would like to get a few rivets and destination sign rubber gasket soon tho. My other thread didn't scare up any ideas. :-[
If you guys have any questions now or in the future, I'd be happy to help with ideas if I can. But one thing I can tell ya------- It's a BIG job.......... but worth it!! ;D ;D ;D ;D
Chaz
Thanks Chaz. Waiting to see the final color. I am hoping to see something really cool an artistic. Not murals or anything but like marbleized candy color. I know you will not just settle for baby blue. ;D