Dear Friends,
I am curious about marker lights.
1. Are more required if the bus is longer, or just one at each end and one in the middle?
2. When you raise your roof, are you also supposed to raise your marker lights? (I see a lot of photos of buses with raised roofs, and the marker light are where they were before the raise.)
3. Has anybody ever been ticketed for improper marker lights? For example: I have heard rumors from trucker friends of California Highway Patrol being strict on this?
4. Do any states require marker lights along the bottom of the bus siding?
Thanks in advance for your comments.
Dr. Steve, central old Mexico
There are very specific requirements. They are detailed here:
http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/standards/conspicuity/TBMpstr.html (http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/standards/conspicuity/TBMpstr.html)
Scroll all the way down to the graphic of a bus, then use the key numbers to refer back to the specific requirement on the chart.
The short answer is that marker lights go top or bottom. Clearance and ID lights need to be at the top, and, yes, if you raise the roof, the clearance and ID lights also need to be raised.
-Sean
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com (http://ourodyssey.blogspot.com)
Wow, Sean! Thanks a million! You are so bright, your Mama calls you son! ;D
That is a great DOT page. I never thought to look there.
Dr. Steve, central old Mexico
Awesome maybe. On my side Marker lights, the previous owner cut the wires. So instead of taking the bus apart to run new wires, I could put new lights down low and just cap the roof holes with reflectors or something. That sounds like an achievable project.
Is that correct what I am seeing? ???
Quote from: NewbeeMC9 on August 15, 2010, 08:35:04 PM
On my side Marker lights, the previous owner cut the wires. ... I could put new lights down low and just cap the roof holes with reflectors or something. ... Is that correct what I am seeing? ???
Yes, if you are talking only about side markers, numbers 4a, 5a, and 12a on the chart. While many buses have both low and high side markers in each position, they are not required; you need only one in each location at a minimum 15" above the ground. Note that you MUST also have reflex reflectors in the lower positions as well, numbers 4b, 5b, and 12b. Where the marker lamp can be at any height above 15", the reflectors must be between 15" and 60" above the ground. Many side marker lamps have built-in reflex reflectors, so in practice it is simpler to use this style lamp and mount it between those heights.
Also note that the front and rear clearance lamps, numbers 2 and 6 on the chart respectively, MUST be at the topmost part of the vehicle. These lamps face front or rear, but, in practice, many bus manufacturers choose to use combination clearance/marker lights in these locations. This is a lamp that is visible from both the front (or rear as the case may be) and the side simultaneously. If the PO has cut these wires, too, I'm afraid you'll have to repair them. There is no wiggle-room on clearance lights. Also the ID lights, which are the three lights together in the middle on the front and rear roof lines, must also be as high as possible.
HTH,
-Sean
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com (http://ourodyssey.blogspot.com)
Thanks, All the other lights work except for the 2 at about midships. I have been suffering about how to fix those without taking the whole bus apart, now I have an Idea. Also wonder if it could have a turn signal in it? That would be nice. Maybe just run it thru a relay where it blinks off with the turn signal. I would like my side turn signal to have light as well.
now that's doable.
Looking at the chart I realize that my bus(4106) has no lights on the side at all. The front and rear clearance lights are sort of visible from the side. Since there never were any am I grandfathered in? It would be a real pain in the but to add those lights now.
Quote from: NewbeeMC9 on August 16, 2010, 03:27:03 AM
... Also wonder if it could have a turn signal in it? That would be nice. Maybe just run it thru a relay where it blinks off with the turn signal.
Yes, you can have auxilliary turn signals on the side. Most bus manufacturers simply install two lamps, one marker and one for turn signal. However, you could also use a dual-filament (or dual-brightness LED) lamp made for the purpose. You can not legally just blink the markers, as they are required to be steadily lit at all times (when required by conditions).
Quote from: sweeney153 on August 16, 2010, 05:21:35 AM
Looking at the chart I realize that my bus(4106) has no lights on the side at all. The front and rear clearance lights are sort of visible from the side. Since there never were any am I grandfathered in?
Vehicles that were built before the current requirements took effect need only have the lights that were installed by the original manufacturer (or equivalent).
That said, more lights are usually better. I would make sure you at least have the reflectors shown in 4b, 5b, and 12b. Reflectors are easy to retrofit.
-Sean
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com (http://ourodyssey.blogspot.com)
Hmmm... Ok.
This brings up a question I was having with a friend a week or so ago:
WHY do you need them?? What is the purpose? I don't quite see the need.
Just curious,
Chaz
Chaz, Think about being stopped or parked across an ally way or something at night. would suck if someone was driving towards you and could not see you head or tail lights. ;D
Really? That's the reason, huh. I guess there is some validity there......... seems kinda stretching tho, especially since it's a "old" law. If it was a law that came out today, with all the PC-ness and no one wanting to take responsibility for themselves, etc., I could totally see it.
But why the ones on the top in front? That was my biggest wonder.
Thanx Eddie,
Chaz
The ones on top are so you can read the clearance signs at night. :D Just kidding I have no idea. I do know or at least seen the reason for the side light is because of long buses and trailers crossing roadways at night backing into driveways.
When the three lights on the roof of the bus came out were they not nick named "Michigan lights" as that was the first state that made it law to have them?.
On a side note the lights on top of the bus in the middle could be seen for along distance if the bus was crossway on the road. Sorta like the old train tracks picture that makes the tracks look like they come together the farther you look down the track.
The terrain on the road could be wavy and the lights would still be visable.
Quote from: Chaz on August 16, 2010, 10:57:31 AM
...
But why the ones on the top in front? That was my biggest wonder.
If you read the NHTSA guidelines you will find the reason there for each and every light.
The three lights top center front and rear are called "Identification lights" and these tell other motorists, law enforcement, toll collectors, etc. that your vehicle is over 80" in width. All vehicles over 80" must have them, and cars and similar vehicles under 80" are forbidden to have them. Light trucks less than 80" can have them optionally and are advised if they routinely tow 80" trailers.
The outermost lights on top front and rear are called "Clearance" lights and they do exactly that: they show other motorists the outer and upper limits of your vehicle. Without these, other vehicles may collide with you in the dark. For example, consider driving your own bus down a narrow, highly-crowned 2-lane road, with a shoulder on either side. If a disabled auto was parked on the shoulder, you may not have to adjust your lane position at all -- even though the crown of the road might mean the very top of the side of your bus might be leaned over into the shoulder lane. The car is not tall enough for you to hit it.
If, on the other hand, a semitrailer was disabled and in the shoulder, you might need to move left and possibly even edge over the center line to provide clearance between the top of your bus and the top of the truck, even if you have a good couple of feet down at ground level. The truck's clearance lights alert you to its presence well before you arrive at it and certainly much sooner than you would see a darkened vehicle.
The side marker lights and reflectors likewise alert other motorists to your presence when approaching from the side. Again, consider a black bus on a dark night pulls out across a narrow road. The headlights may be on one side of the road and the taillights on the other, and a car speeding down that road could not tell there was a 45' barrier across his path until too late.
If you've ever come up on the tail of a vehicle at night with no taillights, you'd know just how hazardous an unlit vehicle can be. More than once I have nearly rear-ended a slow-moving, blacked-out vehicle on a dark highway. My favorites are the idiots who continue driving well past dark with just their DRL's on. Like most codes, every provision of FMVSS 108 (the vehicle lighting code) exists because many have died or been seriously injured before the provision was added.
-Sean
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com (http://ourodyssey.blogspot.com)
Quote from: Paso One on August 16, 2010, 12:32:34 PM
When the three lights on the roof of the bus came out were they not nick named "Michigan lights" as that was the first state that made it law to have them?.
I've not heard that term for them, but maybe I'm not old enough ;)
I do remember the old Interstate Commerce Commission, though, the federal agency charged with regulating interstate trucks back then, and I have heard many drivers call them "ICC lights." (I've also heard the emergency brake valve called an "ICC valve.")
Once upon a time, green was also an allowable color for front ID lamps, and many states still permit them on vehicles that date from when they were legal.
-Sean
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com (http://ourodyssey.blogspot.com)
The maintenance manual for my 4104 referred to them as Michigan Markers".
If you do add reflectors as Sean suggested I would get the tape style reflectors instead of stick on or screw on reflectors.
I personally like the Truck-Lite flat tape reflectors made with 3M material. They should be available at any heavy truck dealer or parts place that carries Truck-Lite, or even NAPA I bet. Peterson also makes some reflectors that are flat metal that don't look like much, but they reflect light like crazy. The Peterson reflectors are sold all over and maybe even Walmart. A lot of places that carry trailer lights have them.