Alright just so john, Jim, & Sean don't feel like they are the only ones with troubles!
One of our "new" to us 2005 Setra S417's has been giving us fits! Well really they both have in a way! (they have both been going thru fuel filters like mad about once or twice a month)
Well any way #742 aka "Touch of Class" has not only been going thru filters. But most recently it started sucking the new filter dry and sputtering or "hiccuping" while running down the road under a load (around 70-75 mph).
So I have been back and forth with Setra tech support and anyone else who might have an idea what could be the problem.
They use a "Raycor" style filter set up with the see thru bowl upside down over the filter that shows when it needs change by how high the fuel level is. And everyone kept telling me "your sucking air somewhere" so I changed filters, O-rings, the bowl, the cap on top of the bowl, etc. any and everything that could be allowing air to get in. NO LUCK!
Well all along I have said that with it going thru the filters so fast I felt it (they) had "trash" in the tanks from when the previous owner had them.
So after Setra has me half convinced that it is the restrictor fitting (check valve) in the return fuel line coming out of the back of the head going to the left side tank. I ordered one and had it overnighted. We were about to change it when I told dad and Booger "ain't no way this is the problem! It could create a lack of back pressure and allow the fuel to flow too fast and empty the filter housing to fast, but if that's the case. It' ain't go NOTHING to do with the filters needing changed so often!"
So dad and Booger reluctantly asked "what's your idea, and how we gonna fix it?"
So I said "I wanna drain the tanks and pull them out and see what's in them!"
They both looked at me with glazed eyes and asked "your kidding right?"
NOPE I backed it half way out of the shop and put my electric primer pump to work filling 4 five gallon fuel jugs (to have something to put back in it!), and the rest into #722 which just happened to be sitting there close by!
Once the pump was done we started it and pulled it right back in over the pit. Booger went underneath and started draining what was left from the drain plug into a drain pan, and disconnecting the 1.5" x 18'' crossover hose while I disconnected things up top and took the straps off them. Once we were both done he used a pry bar to send them out to me while I used one to lift them slightly and out they came!
Well sure enough there was trash in the bottom of both tanks and sludge and a "beetle" (no not Ringo, Paul, John or George) in the top fitting in the pick up tube! Ah, ha! I was right it was starving for fuel from the tank, not lack of back pressure in the heads!
So we blew out the lines and cleaned out the filter base, and as soon as the drum of "cleaner" I ordered gets here we will flush the tanks and put them back in!
;D BK ;D
Bryce
Sounds like your on the right track. I'm bettin crap in the tank. Who is your fuel vendor? Our local fillin stations are infamous for not changing their filters and I suspect they go into a bypass mode when they get full. Good Luck and let us know what you find.
Quote from: Airbag on July 19, 2009, 11:54:14 AM
Bryce
Sounds like your on the right track. I'm bettin crap in the tank. Who is your fuel vendor? Our local fillin stations are infamous for not changing their filters and I suspect they go into a bypass mode when they get full. Good Luck and let us know what you find.
Well see that's the problem these 2 buses had the problem of going thru filters left and right before we bought them! They are the only ones out of all of 6 we have that do this! So it seems to me that the previous owner was buying fuel somewhere that had crap in there underground storage tanks.
As a matter of fact one of the main places he used to buy fuel was right around the corner from his house (he parked them across the street alongside the road), has quit selling diesel. And they had a 5 pump set up for big trucks on the back side and about 16 or so out front for cars! They still sell gas!
;D BK ;D
Here is the bus we are working on.
This is the pick up tube fitting!
top one is the fitting again. Bottom one is inside the left tank looking in from the filler neck!
right side tank looking in it from top! (this is the tank that the engine draws fuel from!)
BK,
THAT is disgusting! Good call on your part.
John
This is the fitting after cleaning it out, and all the stuff that was in it!
more
and more
The hole left in the bus by removing the tanks and the fittings for the return line and vent! ;D BK ;D
Don't let mama see it. She will want to store something there. ::)
Long ago and far away, I had a Champion Motor Home that would run fine, then starve for fuel. If I let it sit a few minutes, it would run great, sometimes for hours, more often only for a few minutes.
Drove me crazy (and it wasn't a very long drive!).
I replaced filters, fuel pump, hoses, carb, even ignition though I was sure it was a fuel problem.
In desperation, I pulled the tank and inside found a gas station paper towel floating around. That was it. Apparently someone in the past had lost the gas cap and used the towel.
A couple years ago, a friends bus started losing power and running poorly on his way home from the Florida Flywheelers show. We temporarily ran a hose from the fuel tank inlet, taped to the side of his bus, and connected to his primary filter inlet. After doing this, he said the bus ran better than it ever had since he owned it. After he got home, he started checking the fuel intake system and found a dead bug in a fitting. I didn't think to ask him if it was a beetle? Jack
Kinda makes you wonder if it wouldn't make sence to take the tanks off and clean them out competely now and then.
Cody,
Funny that you mentioned that. We just had our tank out, and man was it a incredible chore. Our DL3 has a pony tank, that is connected to the main tank by three copper lines underneath the bus. For us it takes at least one full day, if not more to remove that tank.
I hope yours would go faster...
God bless,
John
Most of the stuff in the shots of Bryce's tank looks like the creeping black slime. It's lucky he caught it when he did. When we came down from Fargo in our TDH-3610, we had to stop about every 22 miles and clean the primary fuel strainer because of that stuff. We also went through at least a dozen secondary sock type filters.
Just because it was -22°F didn't make any difference. There's nothing quite as invigorating as doing filters on the side of I-29 at -X° temperatures!
If you suspect you have the crud in your tank, you can go to a nearby marina that deals with larger, diesel type boats and have them "polish" your fuel. It is a bit expensive, but in some cases is a bunch easier than pulling tanks and draining fuel.
Dallas,
What is "polishing" your fuel?
Thanks
God bless,
John
"Polishing" fuel is removing it from the tank and filtering it, then putting it back in the tank Frequently done on boats. Jack
works wonders on fuel filter use but won't help if the tank is full of stuff.
You can make your own set up by taking an electric pump and pushing your fuel through a series of filters starting with 10 micron and finishing with a 2 micron filter. Again it well not help if the tank is dirty.
Don
Yup, gotta agree Don, If your tank isn't full, dump it and clean the tank out well. Next, put some biocide in and enough fuel to make it run again, then run it until the filters are plugged. After that, run it until the filters plug again without putting fuel in.. Then do it again. Pretty much you are doing the same thing as polishing the fuel, except you get to go through a lot more filters for a bit less money.
Quote from: Don Fairchild on July 20, 2009, 03:36:07 PM
works wonders on fuel filter use but won't help if the tank is full of stuff.
You can make your own set up by taking an electric pump and pushing your fuel through a series of filters starting with 10 micron and finishing with a 2 micron filter. Again it well not help if the tank is dirty.
Don
Thanks, now I know what "polishing" is ;D.
God bless,
John