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Bus Discussion => Bus Topics ( click here for quick start! ) => Topic started by: fraser8 on July 11, 2009, 08:12:59 PM

Title: Jake brake failure
Post by: fraser8 on July 11, 2009, 08:12:59 PM
I'm on a tour of the mountains of southern British Columbia heading for a Model 'A' meet in Cranbrook. Yesterday the jake brakes came on while the bus was parked at an idle, quite a racket, I solved the problem by turning the switch off, thinking that I could turn them on while going down hill. Now they don't engage at all. Any ideas out there, I can take it to a truck repair place in Cranbrook but if at all possible I would like to fix it myself. Not that I'm cheap but I've been known to be thrifty.  I miss the old friend while going down the long hills................
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: luvrbus on July 11, 2009, 08:53:27 PM
You have a buffer switch problem check and make sure the lock nut is tight but be careful not to try and adjust it if you don't know anything about Jakes. Does your switch have the hi idle feature.      good luck
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: fraser8 on July 11, 2009, 09:00:04 PM
I have a separate high idle switch, and the jake switch has a high/low/off position. I don't know a lot about the jake brake system but if I have an idea I can take it in and sound good and not get ripped off. thanks luvr, I appreciate the info.
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: luvrbus on July 11, 2009, 09:14:38 PM
Fraser, you have the hi idle Jake buffer switch that is a very expensive switch and most can be repaired the pin falls out , the spring goes bad or the lever made of plastic breaks.A  little advance warning for you that switch cost over 600 bucks now. 
If you can do without the fast idle one will cost you about 230 bucks     good luck
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: Timkar on July 11, 2009, 09:18:18 PM
Saw you as you were leaving a fruit market in Keremeos yesterday. You're right it was sounding bad. As soon as the wife came out I tried to find you but you must have taken Hwy 3 to Ososyoos and I was heading up to Penticton on 3A. Hope you get your problem fixed. Nice looking Prevost...maybe we'll meet up next time.
Tim
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: fraser8 on July 11, 2009, 10:19:46 PM
I was wondering why I had no power, tough starting off with the jake on. Sorry I missed you. Fraser
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: lostagain on July 12, 2009, 08:05:46 AM
In Cranbrook, take it to Inland-Kenworth, 816 Industrial Rd. #1, 250-426-6205. I take the hockey team's bus there every 6 months for the DOT inspection. Really good people.

Another good place is the DD dealer: Cullen Diesel Power, 601 Industrial Rd. #3, 250-426-8271. The manager John knows a lot about 2 stokes.

JC
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: TomC on July 12, 2009, 08:11:34 AM
In a pinch, you can jump the buffer switch, or any of the other switches to make the Jake work.  But then you can only turn it on when you have your foot off the gas pedal and have to turn it off before coming to an idle (in another words-work it manually).  If you do try to accelerate with the Jake on, it will tell you quickly with much smoke and no power.  Good Luck, TomC
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: fraser8 on July 12, 2009, 09:05:28 AM
Here we are on the road, Thanks all for the help, I'll fill you in on the out come....
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: johns4104s on July 12, 2009, 06:35:26 PM
Luvrbus,

I do not have the high idle so my jakes would be less expensive.

John
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: Buffalo SpaceShip on July 12, 2009, 09:19:34 PM
Follow TomC's advice. To take it further, pop the valve covers off and check for power at the solenoids... then apply power to the solenoids one by one.  They will not move much w/o the oil pressure, but you'll definitely see if they're working or not. I was able to diagnose a faulty solenoid this way and pick up a new one at Stewart & Stevenson whilst traveling.

HTH!
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: JackConrad on July 13, 2009, 06:19:52 AM
Jakes can fail mechanically (O rings) as well as electrically.  Jack
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: Stormcloud on July 13, 2009, 07:01:11 AM
Darn nice looking runabout on that trailer, Fraser. Hi to Dorothy from us.

Mark & Donna
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: fraser8 on July 14, 2009, 09:12:33 AM
All is fixed. The wire running to one of the solenoids was scufffed during the installation years ago, inside the cover, it finally shorted against the block and shorted the solenoid out. I replaced the wire and the solenoid. Everything is working wonderful...
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: johns4104s on July 14, 2009, 09:04:29 PM
I talked to a guy today that was against having Jake's,s he said that if there running they are good, but if they start giving problems they can be a nightmare, even damage your engine. He also said they have stopped offering them on the new trucks.

2 cents worth?

John
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: luvrbus on July 14, 2009, 09:30:49 PM
John, that guy is yanking your chain, the new engines most have a 3 speed Jake brake, and Volvo has their own system similar to the Jake. 
The exhaust brake will cause problems sometimes had 3306 Cat that exhaust brake system would break the compression ring on it   good luck
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: Buffalo SpaceShip on July 16, 2009, 08:31:59 AM
Hey, hey, glad to hear you got it fixed!

Side note for all RE Jakes:
Living in CO, I wouldn't dream of owning a coach w/o Jakes.  But I use them all the time on the flats, too... slowing down for curves, speed zones, red lights, etc. Consequently, there's hardly any wear on my rear service brake linings I put in about 10k miles ago. They didn't even need adjusting when I was under there a few weeks back.

Once adjusted and in proper running order, Jakes should give you MANY miles of worry and maintenance-free (and safe) driving. And if you get out of your depth or comfort-zone with troubleshooting and maintenance, I suspect most HD diesel shops can help service them, since they're so common in the trucking industry.

My $0.02,
Brian
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: luvrbus on July 16, 2009, 08:43:19 AM
This is one setup I would love to see how it it wired no way should he have power to the Jake's at idle if wired according to Jake and a broke wire with a bad solenoid under the valve cover make a Jake engage    good luck
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: fraser8 on July 17, 2009, 10:03:19 PM
What happened when the wire broke and shorted out it also damaged the control switch, the one that the wires come off to go to each bank. This wouldn't allow the jakes to come completely off. I was still having a little trouble this morning and took it to Cullen DD in Cranbrook. They pulled both covers off and some time previously two solenoids were replaced with 12 volt ones. We replaced the switch and all four solenoids with 24 volt ones. Hats off to Cullen they sent a mechanic (not a technician) out to the parking lot and he diagnosed the problem in a couple of minutes. Pulled me into the shop and had me going in less than an hour.
And I agree unless I was a flatlander I wouldn't leave home without my old friend Jake... Nothing worse than a sign that says 7% grade for 10 miles...
Title: Re: Jake brake failure
Post by: buswarrior on July 18, 2009, 08:23:45 PM
Some form of engine brake is pretty much standard equipment on all your new big trucks. They are integrated from the drawing board these days.

happy coaching!
buswarrior