I was notified by my next door neighbor that her other neighbor on the other side sighted a mouse in his driveway a while back. I didn't say anything about it to her at the time because I didn't think it applied to me but then she asked me how long I was going to have my bus here at the house. I pretty much blew her off and didn't give a direct reply but the next day I went to see her and asked her more about it all.
She then told me that she had seen a mouse under the fence between our lots and that my bus was the cause of it and also the mouse that was allegedly seen in the other neighbors driveway. I asked her if she thought that maybe the old magazines and other papers the other neighbors stores in large piles in his garage might have anything to do with a field mouse or maybe the fact that we live in the mountains could have something to do with it. I also mentioned the wildlife such as deer, skunk, raccoons etc and an occasional cougar and even an elk or two that stray down here but she told me that no, she was pretty sure that my "diesel bus" was attracting mice. The sad thing is that this woman is an educator and she is so ignorant!
So here I sit now awaiting the city to visit me with a complaint about my bus. I told her that since she is worried of property values I'd paint the face of my house nearest to her pink with lavender stripes and also my fence if I got any complaints and I'd also stop mowing my lawn, let it go to dirt and act like the redneck she believes me to be.
We don't even live in an HOA! I sure wish I could afford to move out away from the city!!
"No Trespassing" signs often work wonders, even with the "authorities"...
As does putting up a "Beware of Dog" sign, and "Trespassers may be shot" sign.
With those three signs up... We never got another visit from the local code enforcement agency... Of course, I also sent them a rather direct letter stating that any attempt to remove my property with or without court order would be met with force...
This, after a neighbor complained and I received those oh-so-lovely stickers plastered all over my bus demanding it be removed within 14 days or it would be towed at my expense... After I put the signs up and replied to the letter, they didn't so much as set foot on the land again... And we do have an HOA, and we are within city limits (but only just barely, like 500 ft).
There's another thread over on skoolie.net (no, that's not an advertisement, just another place I post!) where I went into the specific details, just look through my post history and you'll find it, but that's the gist of what I did...
The local authorities prefer to avoid confrontations rather than provoke them. Their efforts are better spent chasing down the drug dealers and miscreants than spinning their wheels and getting shot at over a bus that's (lawfully) parked on someone's property.
-Mac
I guess she would really freak out around mine. I currently have a possum living under mine.
Treating her with all the seriousness she is due - I guess mice that are attracted to a diet of steel and diesel fuel would be pretty frightful creatures.
Oh yes, and don't forget to buy some plastic pink flamingos and lawn gnomes for your front yard.
A possum?? When did you pick that little guy up? I don't remember you mentioning him when I was there on my way through! ^.^
-Mac
She showed up here with 3 babies about a month ago. The babies seem to have moved on, but she apparently decided to join Jack & Paula's 3 outdoor cats as a resident here.
My nephew said a coon crawled out of the back window, (Yeah like we have one of the UNOBTAINIUM things) of ours one morning. After that when Dianne gets mad at me she says..."I'll send you out to the bus to sleep with 'The furry critters'!"
Jack
What this woman needs to understand is that the average yard is criss-crossed nightly by mice and other "critters".
What makes them locate in your yard or the next is a food source, your local heath dept. will vouch for that. Clear your area of all food
sources (dog food,cat food, garbage, ect.) and the problem will move to the next food source.>>>Dan
Paladin, I live on 70 acres in the middle of no where! A deputy sheriff came on My property and wanted to know why I have so much junk. Read tractors and hay bailing equipment. He never noticed the posted sign and as I have found out does not have to obey them! My collection of antique green tractors apparently bothers the deputy I can assure anyone that my place is a show place compared to the local red necks. There is the problem, simple jealousy. The point is that you can not escape the self appointed pompus uniform wearing Nazi's no matter where You go! I was asked if My bus was yard art and I had to point to the tag, apparently the sheriff doesn't teach deputy's how to read. Funny enough the sheriff is in jail along with a number of His department for all kinds of stealing. He was the head sheriff in Florida until a few months ago when the feds arrested Him in Vegas. We need to start over. My take Regards john
Paladin,
I think you need to warn that poor lady!!! Tell her to watch out for the mouse's teeth!!! A mouse that chews through steel will have powerful teeth that can take of a ARM or LEG instantly :o :o :o. Please tell her to watch out for the real mice that you will let out if she keeps complaining ;D ;D ;D
Thanks for the great story. I am still laughing. The sad part is that it is a real problem that you are dealing with. And that is rough. I hope that you get things figured out.
God bless,
John
Beware of the Stainless Steel Rat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Stainless_Steel_Rat)!
Paladin,
Sorry to hear of your situation! It is so sad when "normal people" don't understand our buses or why we love them!
Now to remedy the problem at hand in a humorous way. I'd take and get a 5 pound bag of sugar and a 5 pound bag of cat food, grind up the cat food and mix the 2 together. Then take a garden fertilizer spreader (one of the small hand held/crank ones, the ones you push are too noisy), and about 2-3 AM in the morning spread it all over her and the other complaining neighbor's yards. After that is done they will have ants, mice, and every other rodent within a square mile camping out on their lawns. Not to mention all the neighbor hood cats coming both for the cat food as well as the "live food"!
Then politely point5 out to her that they seem to have an abundance of pest problems of their own to worry about rather than your cute little diesel mice! ;D
Now just remember I am an equal opportunity advocate not an instigator! ;D BK ;D
Quote from: Paladin on July 05, 2009, 09:13:32 PM
The sad thing is that this woman is an educator and she is so ignorant!
That is sad. And if she is like most modern teachers, she probably prides herself on teaching "tolerance" of other lifestyles and viewponits. Just not in her back yard.
I wish I could remember the details of this story but here is the gist of it.
In a rural area of North Florida, a farmer was in trouble with some neighbors because of a collection of trucks and tractors, and he was technically in violation of some county ordinance. He was being harassed by the local powers until he installed a large sign proclaiming the coming of a new 10,000 head automated pig farm (which would have been legal).
The complaints stopped soon after.
Instead of the 'no trespassing' sign would it be more fun to put a sign that warns people not to feed the snakes?
Cody... Though that might be more funny, it's not legally effective.
If you've posted "No Trespassing" on your property (plainly visible), then not even law enforcement has a leg to stand on if they have no valid reason to be there. They're "Put On Notice" that you do not wish to be bothered unless it's of dire importance...
Writing a ticket isn't considered "Dire", and removing property (towing your bus, for instance) without consent then becomes "Grand Theft", even to law enforcement... They won't attempt it unless they are either REALLY dumb (which is most often the case), or think they have an "air-tight" case.
Unfortunately for the authorities, "air tight" happens about as often as a leak-proof air system on the bus they're towing. ;)
You just have to research your local laws a little to formulate an appropriate response to the threats they present you with. I took about 3 days of researching Louisiana State Law (including the LA Constitution) as well as local law and ordinances before sending my response letter to them...
After that, they didn't bother to contact me again or threaten to STEAL my property... Cite the proper laws, and they haven't got much to assault you with afterwords... And the simple fact that YOU cited the laws to THEM puts them on notice that YOU can do your homework, and understand the laws as they're written... I've found that they're much less likely to pursue their threats if you do this, in addition to throwing out the Constitutional (US and state) rights regarding property ownership and the rights to defend that property. If you make it clear you'll protect your property, whether it be through legal means (the court system), or through the means protected under Constitutional Law... They'll usually back down from their position.
At least, that's been my own experience with these assholes... But you _MUST_ put up the right signage to be able to legally enforce your position!
Even if you don't have a dog, put up the "Beware of Dog" sign anyway... There's no law that says you can't, and most people just don't want to be on your property if you've got up the "No Trespassing" and the dog signs at the same time... Most people equate it to "If I'm on his property, and he lets his dog out... I'm trespassing and would just be lucky to escape with my life."
Just my 2c on the subject....
-Mac
Yeah, I've had some issues with the city and some asshole anonymous neighbors over the past few years. They started by complaining about my bus, but there was nothing the city could do about it. Eventually, they moved on to my pickup, trailer, backhoe, piles of landscape bricks and rocks, and even my garden compost pile. I told them to go to hell on most of it, and did clean up some of the piles of steel I had from the bus project. The city said they only enforce the codes when someone complains, but state law prevents them from telling me who complained. I told them that selective enforcement was illegal and that if they were going to enforce their codes on me, they had to enforce them on every property in the city. They disagreed. Eventually I took a drive down the street on which the code enforcement officer lived, and compiled a list of houses (28 out of 50) which had code violations of one sort or another. I sent a letter to the city and told them every one of the properties was in violation and that they should consider this a formal complaint and so must now investigate each one and take action. I then called the mayor and told him that since I was unemployed and had a lot of time, that I intended to start driving through the city and noting every property with violations and reporting them on a daily basis. His exact words were, "We'd have to hire 10 code enforcement officers." To which I replied, "Well, if that's what it takes. But I'm not going to stand by while you selectively enforce your laws only on me." Shortly thereafter, they changed the way you can report violations. Before, you could make an anonymous phone call. Now you have to fill out a form. I figured I could automate that if necessary, but I haven't heard anything from them for a couple years.
I wish that I had not buckled to the first couple complaints and recycled all the steel I had from the bus. When the next few came in, I really wanted to have that steel still so I could build a sculpture for my front lawn!
Thanks guys, nice to hear that I'm not the crazy one....or are we all crazy???
I do have no trespassing\ no soliciting signs up that I put as per the local police who I spoke to regarding the literally dozens of door to door people who leave flyers posted all over my door. I also have a German Shepherd which my neighbor doesn't like so we have signs that say " Dog On Premises" and "Beware of Dog" .
One of the neat things is that while my neighbor hates dogs though she begrudgingly admits that mine is well behaved is that we have a new GSD puppy coming in from Texas in a few weeks so I'll be right at the local city limit of two dogs.
As for the snake idea, my nephews on Texas suggested that I tell her that we're bringing in Texas rat snakes to handle her dreaded mouse troubles. Hehe.......
My other nephew suggests a plastic mouse put into a tripped mouse trap and set it under the fence. I just wanted to set loose a dozen or so mice under the fence as she drove in one day.
I do have a motion sensor mounted with a 500 watt halogen floodlight and can control it from within my house via home automation. I thought of turning the pole slightly as happened once in a wind storm so that the light shines into her bedroom and then "accidentally" leave the light on, then off, then on during the night.
Gee, maybe I am a terrible neighbor!
Don't provoke her. You are the better person.
I do like the idea of letting it be known that you are bringing in some snakes to handle the "mouse problem". ;)
I understand they have a glut of pythons loose in FL. Maybe you could import some of them. Wouldn't it be fun to let it be known you were planning to bring in some snakes and
then one day there's a large snake or two laying you your grass just far enough away that you just can't be sure if it's real or not? Maybe a little monofilament to make it move once
in awhile.
http://news.mongabay.com/2005/1005-gator.html
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mongabay.com%2Fimages%2Fexternal%2F2005%2Fgator051005183436.jpg&hash=e3097297fe7190bb41b6b96f1e36be910c8a5dab)
Geee, thanks Dallas. That is just sick. The only way that I care to handle snakes is with a nice shotgun...
God bless,
John
Paladin,
I like the snakes idea... XD
But, as for your dog limitations... You might read that law for yourself to see EXACTLY what it states...
In my experience, they can only limit dogs kept OUTSIDE. They can also selectively enforce "exotic" breeds (to which, most birds belong, as do Ferrets and some cats and dogs...)
But normally, they can't limit the number of INDOOR animals you maintain unless there's an obvious case of neglect. Like the stories you hear about the old lady with 50 living cats and 150 in the freezer dead....
That's how it is here where I live, and I'm reasonably certain that's how it was in Alpharetta, GA when I lived there, as well as Madison, WI... Limits to the number of outdoor kept animals, but not indoor.
Read the law carefully to see what it really says, not what the local 'authorities' tell you what it says... They'll almost always lie because they themselves don't know what it actually says... (Gee, law enforcement without a clue what the law actually says? Naw, can't be!!!)
-Mac
What we should really be doing is making an effort to be better busnut ambassadors. There are enough antagonists out there making our lives harder. It is often more productive to work with the flawed system than to try to fix it all at once.
When I wanted to have a busnut rally at a Palmetto Cove Rally Park, I was told NO. But after I looked into it, I found they could not exclude us if we abided by the park rules. I was put on notice that they would be watching very carefully & they kept reiterating 'the rules'.
We put fourth the effort to pay attention to our actions while being true to who we are. If you have been to this park, you will know why we put forth the extra effort. The result is that we are now welcomed with open arms & the park goes out of it's way to help.
(It turned out that there was one 'bad apple' causing the trouble by spreading lies & half truths . . . .)
Knowing the laws & how to apply them in a favorable light to your life is a good thing, but just because you can force an issue isn't enough reason to do so . . . . .
Think honey vs vinegar. 8)
Sometimes, the easiest path starts off with more difficulty. ;)
Lots of people think rats live in the 'abandoned' cars on the neighbor's yard. This is what they want to believe because it places the burden on someone else. I have found the best results by having calm discussions with the county/ city officials - this is where knowing the law & its intent comes in handy.
It has been my experience that it is only a couple of noseybodies that are doing the reporting & the county is less than thrilled to see them walk in. Typically, the officials want the path of least resistance. (Huh, imagine that!) :o
So, if you can 'educate' them to seeing things your way, they will be able to discourage the noseybody making the frivolous reports. Then your life is easier since it is being stopped before you even know about it. 8)
Good Luck!
Have you invited the neighbors a look at your bus project? When we first got the 4104, a couple of neighbors were less than enthusiastic. We took them on a weekend trip to a local state park and never had another problem, even got a little help now and then.
Kyle,
Your post just reinforces what I said... ^.^ Read the laws yourself, make an effort to understand them as they're written (not necessarily as they were originally intended, we all know how THAT usually works out)... Use them to YOUR advantage in making it difficult for someone to harass you. Basically, throw the law back at the law enforcers. It's an effective technique, as long as you can demonstrate that YOU have done your homework and that YOU can read and understand the law.
It really doesn't take a lawyer to write up a letter quoting the law as long as you've researched it yourself and can at least apply it to your situation adequately. I've yet to involve a lawyer when it comes to property, I've let the law speak for itself and I've also let the ignorance of the 'enforcement authorities' come to light for their own education...
Yes, I'm highly protective over my property, family, friends and companion animals and I'll fight tooth and nail for them... And yes, I also make it known that I will, when pushed to a certain point, not back down and will use all the force granted to me by the U.S. Constitution, State Constitution and State / Local laws.
Around here, the 'officials' know I won't put up with any crap, thus they leave me alone. Once you have that reputation of being a formidable opponent (on a legal basis), they will usually think twice before trying to pull their crap again. Louisiana is the only place I've had significant issues and the ONLY place I've threatened "law enforcement officials" with deadly force if provoked.
And no, I was not arrested for that threat (it never got to the point of having to back up the threat)... I think the reason they backed down was because I quoted Constitutional rights to use force to protect my property and life if necessary to do so.
I make a GREAT neighbor.... As long as I'm not provoked by nonsensical bullshit! ;) If someone has a gripe, they're better off talking to me directly rather than trying to 'sic the law' on me. I'm much more receptive, reasonable and respectful when someone actually takes the time to TALK to me about something, rather than hiding behind some schmoe with a badge. It's not easy to provoke me to the point of going to extremes, but it's happened (obviously).
Oh, on a side note... When a criminal action takes place, you have the RIGHT to know who your accuser is. If they can't give you the ability to cross-examine the accuser in court, there is no case... Something else I had brought up to the 'officials' who harassed me about my bus (this was back when I had my 60 footer, by the way... Not the current one that burned.)... I let them know that if I couldn't speak to the person(s) who were 'reporting' me, that there was no case for any criminal complaints as the law guaranteed me the right to face my accuser... They didn't have a response to that one either. lol...
I'm not a lawyer by any means, but I know how to read a section of code and cross-reference the words as they're used in that section. Those things alone are extremely valuable assets in your artillery box against idiot enforcement agencies.
-Mac
Quote from: Len Silva on July 06, 2009, 12:06:19 PM
Have you invited the neighbors a look at your bus project? When we first got the 4104, a couple of neighbors were less than enthusiastic. We took them on a weekend trip to a local state park and never had another problem, even got a little help now and then.
I've never had any complaints from my neighbours, but I am aware that I must aggravate them at times with constant use of power tools etc. My bus 'arrived' in the neighbourhood in 2007, and that Christmas I sent Christmas cards to all my neighbours with the following insert included:
(https://busconversionmagazine.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.payhost.net%2FMaggie-card.jpg&hash=c943d47684ff8c690113e6057af5f15d0f107596)
I like to think it contributed something to neighbourhood relations.
Jeremy
PS. I'm not in the habit of giving names to vehicles (other than boats), but a friend of mine suggested that my bus should be called Maggie, and it stuck (it relates to an avatar character on my website called 'Maggie Zene')
Mac,
I'm mainly concerned with the sound of belligerence in your actions, threatening a law officer with deadly force doesn't seem a good idea to me.
You need to remember that you ain't like those who the cops normally deal with, so act accordingly, you know - educated & reasonable, but firm in your convictions (without the hostility) that you ARE a law abiding citizen.
Maybe it's just me, but I've found that addressing an issue with calm logic backed up with references to the law minimized the defenses you have to encounter (they don't escalate into attack mode). This calmness has even won me allies in the county zoning department. :o Now the complainer is shut down when they try to complain & I don't have to bother with a response.
I'm not always able to stay calm, but when I do, the expense of being right is greatly reduced. 8)
It always costs me more $$$ & time when I start shouting. :(
Oh, don't get me wrong, I was reasonable first... Polite and all... But, they escalated... So, I was forced to escalate as well.
I wouldn't actually suggest that someone take the same stance that I did, which is why I said to research the specific sections of code that you're accused of violating and escalate as necessary...
I was forced to become hostile because it became known that the "new neighbor" that had JUST moved in was the one that filed the complaints and just wouldn't quit being an asshole about it. He had just retired from the very same board of ordinance enforcement that he was complaining to, thus gained favor and priority in his complaints (don't you love how that works?)...
Since their threats escalated to the point of removal of my (legally) owned and parked vehicle, I was forced to take a stronger stance against the tyranny and injustice. I'm all for trying to resolve peacefully whenever possible, but at the same time, I won't back down when I know I'm in the right and I'll defend myself, my property and my family with any means available to me at the moment.
They now know that and won't even step onto the property (except in an emergency situation, such as the recent fire)... But even then, the police themselves wouldn't set foot on the property... At least, not that I observed... Only the fire personnel would (my father has numerous connections within the fire depts). Which I'm just fine with.
But, as I said, I wouldn't recommend that someone follow in my footsteps with threatening the police with lethal force unless you're absolutely sure you're going to be the one that comes out on top without a direct confrontation (and even then, you risk being thrown in jail just for the threat).
I only stated what *I* did, not what someone else should do... Except for the researching the law yourself, that is. ;)
-Mac
Kyle, I agree with you here.
Mac, I would be very careful if I were you. You are right, threatening a police officer could get you in major trouble (I don't care how many laws you researched). (Cody we need some of your input here.)
One thing with the government, or inspectors, or code enforcement, YOU will NEVER, NEVER, NEVER win against them, if they decide to fight. I don't care how many laws that there are. THEY will ALWAYS win, whether it be now or later.
I have taken the approach to always get along with the people in government. We have a great relationship with all of the officers, and government officials. Life is so much easier that way. If the code enforcement guys ever have a problem with us, THEY are the ones telling us what little tweaks we can do to get the issue fixed. We aren't pointing out the no trespassing signs etc.
The only exception to our policy is the appraiser. He is allowed on the front of our property, and that is it.
God bless,
John
John, I can only address the laws as they apply to Michigan but a threat against a law enforcement officer is a high misdemenor based on the availability of intent, an attempt to carry out the threat is a felony punishable by up to a year in jail, an attempt followed by physical contact, even slight, is a felony punishable by up to 5 years in jail for the first offense with no mitigation. Availability of intent is based on the physical ability of the person to acrually carry out the threat, a threat of pulling the persons lower lip over the top of their head and then forcing them to swallow would be viewed as being unavailable so would carry none if any weight, a threat of a physical beating or as noted lethal force would be viewed as much more viable and could result in a charge being filed. We often used these charges as a means of protecting our staff in the performance of their duties, I signed at least 100 different warrents for the this in probably the last 2 years I worked for the state. I'd recommend the legal system before resorting to self help every time but I do know that at times this is very hard advice to follow. In each instance of charges being files, the burden of proof always falls on the staff enforcing the law but as always the courts seem to favor the officers and the judgement of the officers, that by itself sometimes makes it hard for a citizen to prevail.
Quote from: MacGyver on July 06, 2009, 08:50:25 AM
If you've posted "No Trespassing" on your property (plainly visible), then not even law enforcement has a leg to stand on if they have no valid reason to be there. They're "Put On Notice" that you do not wish to be bothered unless it's of dire importance...
Sorry, not true. Even in the few places where such signs are actually given force of law, and you have the actual sign with the right wording, the government, utility companies and various others are given exemptions in the law which gives those powers in the first place.
In Michigan, a "NO Trespassing" sign carries no legal weight for law enforcement or emergency personnel, none at all, to take it a step further all an officer needs is "probable cause" to enter a home without the occupants permission tho many would wait for the search warrent, if an officer feels that there may be a crime in commission or the possible destruction of evidence the officer can and will enter a home to sieze and preserve that evidence, before that evidence is removed from the site it's always a good idea to get the warrent, especially if the preservation of the evidence isn't an issue from the standpoint of admissability in court, it takes strong evidence of the probable destruction of the items to pursuade the judge that it was necessary to sieze it without following channels. The idea of "a mans home is his castle" fell by the wayside many years ago in the supreme court, the idea was replace by the new premise of "probable cause".
They say "You can't fight city hall". That's not true, you can fight them. You just can't beat them.
Thanks Cody. You reinforced a lot of what I already thought. I would doubt that Michigan and Louisiana are that different at all. I have a little background of having police officers, FBI, Secret Service, and CIA agents as buddies. One doesn't hang around them too much, before they start to catch onto the different "rules".... ;D
B6G, Makes sense to me.
Len, you couldn't have put it better. Give a petty government official a little power, and he will use every ounce of it.
God bless,
John
Fighting city hall is like wrestling a pig -
You're gonna get dirty & the pig is gonna enjoy it.
If a judge isn't around, the next 'higher authority' would be the dude with the gun & a badge. 8)
I've seen the results in court & the differences an effective lawyer can make. The well prepared realize that truth & justice seldom make it past the first step at the court house, let alone past the court house doors.
Good lawyers will be well prepared by having studied more than just the applicable laws & codes. They will also research the others that will be in court (the judge, the other lawyers, the cops, etc.) so they will be able to present the 'facts' in such a way to support the interpretation of the law so it supports the perception you want.
You won't know if you have a good lawyer until after the judge makes his decision . . . .
A good lawyer will also research past rulings on similar cases from other states, statues are always subject to interpretation and change, I learned a long time ago to not second guess a judge. Thats why I alway stressed preserving the chain of evidence, I've seen otherwise strong cases shredded by a good lawyer.
As I said... I wouldn't recommend anyone take the path I chose to take... I was simply fed up with the bullshit from the idiot next door and his buddies constantly threatening to "impound" my lawfully owned property, so I took a stance against it and they backed down.
That's probably a 1 in 1000 (or higher) odds of that actually happening. Yes, I was lucky they didn't try to do anything more. Yes, it was likely a stupid thing to do. But, it's what *I* did, and it solved the problem (and many others that would've cropped up had I simply complied and moved the bus to storage.)
Whether the threats were legal or not is irrelevant at this point... The "friendly neighbor" pushed me to an extreme that I normally wouldn't have gone to, and after it was all said and done, the neighbor found out that I wasn't going to play his game of cat & mouse... I simply wasn't going to be the mouse hiding under the porch steps. I made sure he knew I was the leopard in the tree above his head. ;)
-Mac
Quote from: kyle4501
Think honey vs vinegar. 8)
Sometimes, the easiest path starts off with more difficulty. ;)
Lots of people think rats live in the 'abandoned' cars on the neighbor's yard. This is what they want to believe because it places the burden on someone else. I have found the best results by having calm discussions with the county/ city officials - this is where knowing the law & its intent comes in handy.
It has been my experience that it is only a couple of noseybodies that are doing the reporting & the county is less than thrilled to see them walk in. Typically, the officials want the path of least resistance. (Huh, imagine that!) :o
Good Luck!
Exactly what I said.... 'er sorta! I suggested sugar, but a nice coat of honey and cat food will work too! ;D
;D BK ;D
One thing to keep in mind is that Mac's success with that method was in Louisiana. A rather unique place when it comes to law enforcement and govt. officials. As Mac pointed out, it probably wouldn't work most places. And he did try to be cooperative and nice first.
Fortunately for me in my experiences, I always found officers to be much more open minded and cooperative when spoke to respectfully and as friendly as the circumstance allows. As someone stated in another thread some time back and has been referenced earlier in this one, "Make every effort to show them you are a 'good' guy and not one of the 'bad' guys." Speak friendly to them. If the situation enables it, tell them about your plans and dreams for the bus. Humanize the situation for them. Maybe even spark a little interest/dream of their own.
That said, some officers are in the job for the wrong reasons and are certifiable a/r control freaks with bad attitudes and being nice probably won't change that. And if you are severely in violation of the law, they probably won't let it slide completely no matter what you do. But even in those cases it can help ease the situation up a little.
Bus nuts have a bad wrap to overcome anyway because of some of the stereotypes out there. I mean no disrespect to skoolies, I have seen some really well done ones over on skoolie.net. But you also have to admit there are enough of them out there that shout psychedelic drugs, wild thing, or rebellion against "the man" very loudly. I'm not even saying anything about the right of those people to express themselves. But it does cause a lot of people to conjure a less than flattering image in their mind when one says "bus conversion."
So as someone referenced earlier, it helps all bus nuts every time one of us presents themselves to the public or authorities in a way that improves the perception of bus conversions. And unfortunately it goes against the perception of us all when one of us gets backed into a corner and reinforces the negative perception.
Thanks, Mike...
Like I said... I tried to be nice about it up front... I showed that the bus was legal and legitimately parked on our property... It was pure luck that I found out who was actually phoning in the reports, and that he had JUST retired from the very same board of code enforcement...
Because he was a 'favorite' over there, they gave his reports priority and refused to back down... I had the choice of either hiring a lawyer to fight them in court, move the bus as demanded or taking the path I did. I had very little to actually lose at the time, and I was just fed up with the crap...
I will add that my letter to the board was CC'd to the Sheriff's dep't. and put on file, but I'll also add that my threats were directed specifically at the board for their obvious legal breaches in their demands. I never did get the story about why they backed down, just that they did and haven't bothered us since.
I did find out some time later that the guy that kept phoning in reports (the recent retiree) was told that they could no longer address the issue because I had demonstrated willingness to use lethal force to protect my property, and that he should not, under any circumstance, approach me directly and provoke a confrontation if he valued his life.
I thought it was rather funny, honestly... I did threaten to shoot anyone on the property engaged in the illegal removal of my property (the bus), but really had no way to back up that threat. At the time, we had no handguns... Only shotguns, but no ammo... We did have a couple of Japanese swords, but they were decorative and unsharpened (except for the tip, which gave me a nasty set of stitches when I was a kid! lol)...
I can only assume, at this point, that they felt the risk of a confrontation leading to mortal injury wasn't worth the risk of providing favoritism to the neighbor... I also had no violations with the bus.. It was legally registered, insured and inspected. It was parked on the side of the house behind the shrubs... The guy across the street just didn't like the fact that he could see it from his front lawn.
And... Since then... He's actually turned into not such a bad neighbor. I'm guessing he's either been nice since then so as not to provoke me, or, he's decided that it just isn't worth going to war over a bus. Either way, I don't care... The complaints abruptly stopped and no problems since.
And, as I said, it's not a path I'd recommend... Chances of the same outcome would be very, VERY low.
I will say that I know of no tow truck in this area capable of towing the 60 footer I had in the first place. The folks that eventually bought it from me owned a tow and truck repair shop and their biggest tow truck was only capable of dragging it across the field it was parked in. Aside from that, the guy said that the bus was too heavy to actually hook and tow away and asked if I'd be willing to drive it to their shop because he wasn't comfortable driving it himself (he'd never driven a bus that large)... I went ahead and drove it for him and showed him how everything worked once it was on-site.
He was happy with the purchase, but only wanted the engine/transmission and the Webasto water heater. heh...
-Mac
One aspect here that hasn't been addressed and i'm curious about is the nature of the violation, if would either be a civil or a criminal violation, I'm guessing it was a zonal violation which places it in the area of a civil infraction, a criminal complaint has a box where the MCL (michigan criminal code number) is entered, if it were in another state their number would have to be entered, as far as a civil infraction would go, the local deputy could hand deliver the 'notice of intent to hold a hearing' but would have little if any authority to enforce a zonal violation, after the hearing in court the decision would be enforced by the local law enforcement agency but being civil in nature would tend to place it on the backburner unless the court docket was such that they had time, in many communities the court docket is so jammed up that they may make an attempt to get compliance but if immediate compliance isn't attained they usually throw it on the back burner until later, and is sometimes forgotten or placed as inactive until such a time as an ordinance with teeth is enacted, by then it's usually grandfathered in anyway. In most communities a threat of lethal force is usually addressed by a swat team tho so I would give that a lot of thought beforehand. I live in fear of watching a "breaking news" story on tv and see officers approaching my house lol.
Cody,
You should see the Swat truck we have here...LOL...I am not sure what they use it for. It looks more like a tank.
God bless,
John
Michigan is too broke to allow us to think of that, in the cities swat teams are very busy but in the upper penninsula a swat team is mainly active after dark and mostly after mosquitos lol.
Quote from: cody on July 07, 2009, 06:15:04 AM
I live in fear of watching a "breaking news" story on tv and see officers approaching my house lol.
Yup, that would sure put a skid on the whole day. lol
And you wouldn't even have time to do something like Clint Eastwood did to a bus in his movie "The Gauntlet".
Quote from: John316 on July 07, 2009, 06:18:12 AM
Cody,
You should see the Swat truck we have here...LOL...I am not sure what they use it for. It looks more like a tank.
God bless,
John
Kind of like one of these:
Wow, your mosquito's must be monsters.
Actually it is very similar. I am not sure where they got the money for it. It is state of the art....
God bless,
John
There are several dozen of those and similar parked beside of I-95 about midway through GA.
JAck
Several years ago we lived in the San Gabriel Mountains in So. California. We had no end of problems with people turning up our road and through a gate with private property sign on it. I talked with a customer of mine and he suggested this: "Private Property, No Tresspassing, Commercial Traffic Prohibited, Entrance by Appointment only!" Just remember to leave the phone number off. Our unwanted traffic dribbled to a stop. I thanked my customer several time for the idea.
When you live in an area like we do that has very few people, (the UP is bigger than some states and has less people in it than a very small city) you have quite a bit of room between houses. Our Skanee house has 40 miles of nothing behind it, in this type of setting people are much easier to get along with, for the most part the only people that stop into the skanee house are either lost and looking for directions or actually looking for us. Its the skanee house that will be home to the anti-KOA.
Cody...what is a 'skanee house'?
Thanks
Jack
We keep 2 of our houses for personal use, we have the Skanee house, thats a home in Skanee, a small town, and the Baraga house, thats where we are right now, Baraga is a small town on Lake Superior, for the most part our daughter jamie lives in this one and looks after the others when we are wandering around lost and homely. We have some others that we use for rentals for income purposes but the skanee house and the baraga house are for our use, the skanee house is where I'm building sites for buses to escape the southern heat, called the anti-KOA, with good rules to keep it nice, rules like all adult beverages must be in the original containers and all rv's newer than 10 years must be approved, all dogs must run free and enjoy life, stuff like that. lol
Quote from: cody on July 08, 2009, 06:06:13 AM
... rules like all adult beverages must be in the original containers and all rv's newer than 10 years must be approved, all dogs must run free and enjoy life, stuff like that. lol
Well, that puts me out! My son got me some pilsner glasses that have a gel in the sides. You freeze them and they'll stay cold through 2, maybe 3, beers, depending on the speed you drink them. Guess I'll have to park at the local walmart.
Dang uppity park owners! ::)
Craig...I am sure Cody will let you use those galasses...provided you keep the original container in sight...those things work...even when it hit 100 here!
JAck
Cody, thanks for 'plainin' that to me...I thought maybe there was a type of hose I had not heard about!
Jack
A lot of town names in the great Ice Bowl of the USA are from Indian names... In this case, Chippewa.... I'm descended from the Ojibwa (North of the Canadian border), but they happen to be known as Chippewa once you move south of the Canadian border. :) At least, that's how it's been explained to me throughout my life... It's unfortunate, but my Grandmother actually destroyed all records of this MANY before she died because it was a "family shame" at the time. :( Any hope of finding the proof of it died with her. Sigh. Maybe someday I'll be able to research it and find the connection on my own...
How Baraga County's name originated:
Named for missionary Bishop Frederick Baraga (1797-1868); who worked among the Native Americans in the area and wrote a Chippewa grammar and dictionary.
Baraga County Official Website: http://www.baragacounty.org/
-Mac
Actually your pretty close, Skanee was named for the town that some of the swedish imigrants that founded it were from, Skane in sweden, Yep biship baraga was a major player in this area, as was father marquette. The local tribe here still refer to themselves as Ojibwa but the term is pretty much interchangable, My great grandmother was 100% cree up till around her 7th birthday, she was removed from her people NW of LaTour, west of Quebec City by the Jesuit missionaries and she suddenly became french canadian and her complete history was misplaced at that point at the mission school, I'm sure it was just misplaced lol.