BCM Community

Just trying to get a handle on what everyone across the country would like to see and attend IF they were to attend a bus rally! I personally have only attended One Large rallies for 9 years straight and one small rally. There have been informal get togethers but those were just that, and not really a rally as we know them.
If you have other ideas as to what you would like to see IN a rally, please post it. Maybe I can add it to the list.

NO, I am not going to be putting a rally together but to be honest, when I was recently in Arcadia, I was in a conversation with another bus owner and his opinion differed regarding what he expected. Although this was I believe his first attendance, I was surprised at what his opinion actually was and thought I would ask our nation of bus enthusiest that we have here exactly what they would expect or want.

Please rally hosters of present, refrain from posting what you have at your OWN rally but more of what you would want IF you traveled to another!

Thanks...

Ace,

I don't see my preference among your listed choices.

To me, vendors and seminars make a rally worthwhile.  I couldn't care less about entertainment -- I generally don't attend it, and would rather not pay for it.

Meals I can take or leave.  I don't care for pot-lucks.  Either cater the meals, leave them out altogether (eat "on your own"), or make it optional at extra cost (e.g. cash-basis food vendor, or purchase "meal tickets" in advance).

Because larger rallies attract more vendors and more seminar presenters, I prefer larger rallies.

FWIW, YMMV, etc.

-Sean
http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com

Ace, being the second (Sean posted while I was typing) to vote, I'd like to vote for them all!  I went to my first two rallies that were less than 30 coaches and had a ball.  These were self entertained, potluck for some meals and food supplied for others in the same rally.  I'd like to see some large rally closer to the midwest.  As an entertainer myself, (and having done a dozen or so regional and national RV rallies) I've gotta support having entertainment!  ;)  The Monaco National rally even had complimentary champagne!  Now I know why S&S's cut corners - they gotta afford the entertainment! ::)  I'd like to see seminars at all rallys.  There is always something new to learn.  Vendors are not too important.

Glenn

Sean, first off I want to say how sorry I was that I wasn't able to spend more time with you when you visited our coach. You know the situation so no need to go into detail here but what little time we shared was most enjoyable!

I REALLY appreciate your input. It gave me some ideas that have never been addressed and I really like the idea regarding the meal ticket/s. Not everyone likes what is offered by a caterer and if a planned rally has a menu in advance, those attending can choose to eat or not eat by sending in a pre payment for meals. Maybe they could receive an arm band or a meal ticket IF they chose to attend the meals and no arm band or ticket if they chose not to. Let's face it, as an example, not everyone likes fish if the caterer was offering fish and it was listed as a meal in advance! The registered party has the choice of cooking for themselves or attending the rally meal. This might also help the rally host/club know in advance how much food will be needed and how much they will have to spend rather than cooking on a limb and then having a huge bill and/or many left overs!
As for entertainment? I agree to an extent but I feel that technical seminars, although very educational are for those that are interested. For example, the seminars that were held in Arcadia were good BUT, none of them had a full house so to speak. There will always be those that are not interested. I feel some sort of entertainment could be on the grounds to keep the "others" occupied, not to mention things for the women and children.  My opinion is, something should be happening all the time for everyone!

Keep the comments coming....
Ace

I'm with Sean - the paid entertainment doesn't do anything for me.  Its the seminars and the vendors that will keep me coming back.  My choice isn't really on your list so I didn't vote.  My vote would be:
- lots of vendors
- catered meals
- over 100 coaches
- no official entertainment

As I mentioned last night, I think the challenge is to facilitate attendees meeting new people because that is what will keep us coming back.  The insistence on wearing nametags at Arcadia was a great idea but there are more things that can be done.  There are some structures that can be incorporated into seminars that will enable participants to meet each other.  Mentoring or buddying between old repeat and first time attendees is another possibility.  

Good idea for a poll and very timely - just need a few more options.

Bob, as I stated, I know I don't have all the options listed but you bring up some more good points. I like the idea of having newbies meeting and getting to know old regulars. Some people are shy and some are more out going. If there was a way to team the two together, more friends would be made in the end and at the same time, it would be fun! Remember the "after Rally get together" we had? Although it was a bit cool for us southerners WITHOUT the scotch, many new friends were made and fun and laughter was had by all! Yea I even saw you laughing at times!
As for Vendors? I think a rally needs vendors. The more the merrier! For example: almost every bus, not all of them, had "junk" out in front for sale. That JUNK brought people out in a parade like fashion every day just to see what deals they could find. It's no different if a rally had MANY vendors. I think a rally of good size (100 plus) should have a fair like atmosphere. Let's face it, we're ALL looking for a deal here and there and the old saying goes, "one man's junk is another man's treasure"!

In my conversation with the new guy I mentioned earlier, I made the comment about I wish the rally could grow bigger than it was and his comment was, it's big enough. I also said that if A rally had some corporate backing, it's possible that it could fill the empty fields with motor homes (s&s) and he stated that if it got bigger with more vendors, it would become more of a business. Uhh am I missing something here? Anytime you pay money to be some place, regardless of what it's intention is, it IS a business! ONLY time I consider anything not a business is when it's free and I don't see anyone saying that word!

Ace

Ace -

Interesting poll, and interesting comments, thus far.  Here's my take, even though I didn't get down there this year, sadly. . .

I went to each of MAK's BCM conventions in the middle '90's, and they were completely different from a bus rally.  Oh, sure, there were a lot of buses in attendance, but the emphasis was on the vendors & seminars.  First year, the Oak Ridge Boys were in town, and our convention ticket got us in to see them, too.  But it was an industry convention, just like most industries have, so quite different than Jack's in FL and Dave's in OR.

The first time I was at a major bus rally, in the commonly known term, was Arcadia 2003/2004, at the old Horizon yard.  To be honest, even though I've been in the bus industry for years, I was almost totally overwhelmed!  So many different buses, so many people to put internet names to faces, so many seminars (one of which Luke & I put on together), and literally not enough time to do everything I wanted to do.  But I had a GREAT time!

Two years later I was back, the first year at the Turner Center.  Again, with so many coaches, renewing old friendships, making new ones, putting on a seminar, and the fact that neither time I was there in my own coach, there's just too much to do and too little time to do it.  But again, I had a GREAT time, and was really bummed not to be able to make it this year.

This last summer I went to the big rally in OR, and although attendance was down due to fuel prices, there was still a respectable turn out, I got to do another seminar, put internet names to faces and make new friends without enough time to do it all, again.  Naturally, I had a GREAT time. . .

So I've seen the two big annual rallies on each coast, MAK's conventions, and been able to drop in, for a day, at a couple of local gatherings.  As you can probably surmise, they all have their pros and cons. . .  But being the genuine busnut that I am, I love it all.

With that out of the way, I'd say I would lean more on having decent seminars for both the guys & the gals (especially "new" topics), a few vendors (but not enough to turn it into a "convention"), and lots of free time to visit.  For meals, I like the idea of optional meal tickets for a catered vendor, but that gets into the sticky area of having sold enough tickets to warrant having the caterer be there.  Modifying that somewhat, to have a meal ticket for the "big bash" on New Year's Eve, with pot luck or everybody on their own on other nights, would help keep meal costs down.   Oh, and the caterer MUST be able to serve 200 or so folk quickly, so you don't have people finished and getting up to leave before everybody's served.

Entertainment is a mixed blessing.  Impromptu "pickin' & grinnin" sessions can be a lot of fun, paid folk don't always appeal to the "masses", and some forms just plain flop totally.

As for the "shy" folk, how about having them park between two "old timers"?  Might ruffle a few feathers, but it would also give the "first time" folk an opportunity to meet and get to know some of the folk who have been around for a long time.

One thing I have noticed, tho, is that more and more folk who attend have coaches that are already finished, as opposed to those who are in the conversion/reconversion process.  Don't know if this will have an adverse affect on attendance, particularly at seminars, so that's something that has to be considered.

Something else, too, along this line.  As the demographic ages, we'll be seeing a gradual drop in the number of folk enjoying our hobby.  Besides the aging issue, another one is the increased complexity of the modern coach, and the difficulty of the average "shade tree technician" to work on them.  Just like our cars.  This may be a moot point, because the younger generations are growing up with all these complexities and think nothing of them.  (You know, if you have computer problems, call over the neighbor's 14-year old.)  Then again, maybe not. . .

Will be interesting to follow this thread further!

FWIW & HTH. . .

;) 

We had a ball at Jack's bus rally

Impossible to please everyone at every rally

Particularly if you run out of scotch

I would think that every rally or convention would have it's own personality

The ones you like you go back to and the rally or convention you don't like you just never return

I kind of like the idea of mixing people up based on how far along their conversions are and if they are new or old

BUT I still stand by my observation that if you like a rally or convention you will return and if you don't you won't be back

It was nice to meet you Ace

Melbo

In 1995 I went to the Bus Conversion magazine get together in Laughlin, Nv at the Riverside resort.  We had the Oak Ridge Boys entertain, both MCI and Prevost had their factory reps there along with Detroit and Allison.  It was a big get together in a big tent in the parking lot with somewhere around 500 buses.  All I had in my bus was the rear bed, bathroom, a cooler for my refrigerator, hot plate and microwave-and I had a blast!  I would love to see that caliber of bus conversion convention again, and not have to here about the organizers wimping out because it is too much work (I'll gladly be on the organizing team!).  Good Luck, TomC

Ace,

I am diagonally opposed to Jacks rally ???....living in Orygun,as I do. :P  I surely hope to make the event at least once after Momma retires.  I feel really bad keeping her nose to the grindstone, particularly since I have been retired for 19 years now.  Really bad. ::) ;) ;D ;D ;D

I hope to meet you and many many others when we do or before that time if possible.

Thanks for what you are doing here and find an organizer spot for Tom :)

John

We haven't made it to any of the larger bus gatherings yet so I have no input there.

That is the reason I started a smaller get together in Texas. We don't have seminars etc., but we have lots of fun. With fewer buses and bus nuts to visit with we all have the chance to relax, have fun and get to make friends with everyone.

Smaller rallies offer a chance to kick back without the pressure of trying to see everything.

The larger rallies have everything a busnut could only dream of.

We need all kinds, small, large and in between to help us with this disease we all have. They all offer us the satisfaction of getting out and enjoying life.

So you see, all shapes and sizes are important, no one size is better than the other.

One day we will make to Jack and Paula's and to Busn USA in Oregon. Until then, be safe, enjoy life and make lots of friends doing it. ;)

Start a smaller bus rally in your area, it's lots of fun and you don't have to drive so far! ::)

TBR 2009! Be There!

Happy Trails,

Paul

   OK, I voted for the type of Rally I like, not our rally.  I prefer a small rally of 12-25 coaches with potluck meals (maybe meat furnished) and "make your own" entertainment. However, to accomplish that at our rally, I would have to refuse admittance to over 75% of those that attended (that will never happen!).
   We have found that potluck does not work for more than about 35 coaches. With many food choices the lines are so slow and the last in line usually have a choice  od several bake beans and potato salads (all the good stuff is gone). 
    To show that you will never please everyone, When looking through the rally comment forms yesterday (yes, we do read these), one requested no evening entertainment and the very next form requested more evening entertainment. Another requested all potluck meals while one wanted full meals with menu choices every night.
   One of our primary concerns is always rally fees. Obvoiusly, the more we offer, the more we have to charge. Our goal to to try to provide something for everyone AND keep the rally fee low enough that everyone can afford to attend.  Jack

We've only been to one rally, Bussin '08, and didn't even have our bus with us, but still had a great time. As "newbies", both to bus conversions and to Rallies, the things we loved we're being able to see buses and talk to the owners who built them. We left Fla with a sense of confidence that we could actually do this. I don't think we would have got that same great info had we spent a bunch of time with manufacturers or bus salesman. The few vender's there were ok, but we spent much more time (and $$$) at the folks selling stuff by there bus...sort of the flea market atmosphere. Food I could go either way on.. I love cooking and entertaining, but the night of the chicken dinner gave us the opportunity to meet a bunch of new folks. More entertainment would be ok, but not at the cost of a higher entrance price. I like to see group activities / entertainment.. For us, the whole rally thing is about meeting new folks and making new friends. As far as the number goes, at this point Id prefer bigger rallies..the more buses, the more there is to learn, but I can also appreciate a smaller rally where you get a chance to just relax and hang out for a few days..

Quote from: JackConrad
   OK, I voted for the type of Rally I like, not our rally.  I prefer a small rally of 12-25 coaches with potluck meals (maybe meat furnished) and "make your own" entertainment. However, to accomplish that at our rally, I would have to refuse admittance to over 75% of those that attended (that will never happen!).
   We have found that potluck does not work for more than about 35 coaches. With many food choices the lines are so slow and the last in line usually have a choice  od several bake beans and potato salads (all the good stuff is gone). 
    To show that you will never please everyone, When looking through the rally comment forms yesterday (yes, we do read these), one requested no evening entertainment and the very next form requested more evening entertainment. Another requested all potluck meals while one wanted full meals with menu choices every night.
   One of our primary concerns is always rally fees. Obvoiusly, the more we offer, the more we have to charge. Our goal to to try to provide something for everyone AND keep the rally fee low enough that everyone can afford to attend.  Jack

Well said Jack! And I agree there's no way I would shrink the size of my birthday celebration/Party either! LOL!  ;D  BK  ;D

Quote from: JohnEd on January 03, 2009, 12:49:50 AM

I am diagonally opposed to Jacks rally ???....living in Orygun,as I do.

John -

Hmmmm. . . living in OR, eh?  So there's no excuse for you to miss Busin'USA next June outside Salem, is there?

Right?

;)

I have only been to one bus rally and that was without the bus.  So I can not comment from experience there.  But I have been to many rallies in the motorcycle world.

There is NO perfect rally!

As has been stated you can't please everyone.  So you go for the best you can do.  All different rally sizes and variations have their place.

The small rallies with just buses and people are great for swapping lies, meeting new folks and relaxing.  The large rallies with planned events, seminars, entertainment and catered meals are also great.  Where else can you find such expertise and knowledge of buses crammed into  one place. 

When possible I like to attend every variety available.  The small informal rallies are great weekend getaways.   The major rallies are an event, a destination. 

At the large motorcycle rallies they use colored wrist bands.  Day passes are one color full attendees another.  They also have another color for meals.  This becomes more work for the host for sure.  But , they post the event well in advance and the menu choices are listed.  When you send in your paperwork you pay accordingly. 

Most event planners I have talked to say they plan a small percentage of extra for late shows and those who decide at the last minute they need a meal ticket.  I think at the large rallies the meals are a positive draw for new attendees.  It would be for me, my bus is still a steel tent, so not having to go find a restaurant or prepare meals on a camp stove every meal is a plus. 

As far as seminars, I like them.  And they don't have to be tech seminars only.  The wife said she would like to see someone put on a seminar for new folks about the changes you must make in your lifestyle for every day activities like cooking/cleaning/bathing/laundry  etc.   

I think the cost for most vendors prohibits them attending small rallies.  But at a large rally vendors are great and so are flea markets or individual items at buses.

Music is a can't win situation.  No matter what type it is someone won't like it.  And if you don't have it there will be those who will not be happy.  Whether it is a paid performer or an informal jam session the only request I would have is that it be kept to a dull roar so those who do not wish to participate don't have to walk around with cotton in their ears.

So the short end to this long rambling is they are all good :)

Frank

Ok thanks for the comments! I'll go right to my point!
I talk to a lot of people during my stay at bussin and over the years, I continually get asked if next year will be different? My reply is usually, in what way? The return reply is usually centered around things to do. Let's face it, if it weren't for the personal junk for sale, times COULD get boring for some. Note I said could! I'm never bored. I'm always into something that satisfies ME, but I've been there 9 years! It's the newbies I'm concerned about!
I had a friend go there for his first time last year and his response to me was, where are all the vendors? He was expecting more since he was familiar with the hot rod Turkey Run held in Daytona. To say the least, he was dissapointed and didn't return this year! I guess this rally started out as my idea to share other conversion ideas, tips, tricks, etc amongst other self converters and back when I mentioned it, Jack took the ball and ran with it. It has become what it is and as we know it. I hate to hear or see anyone NOT wanting to return because its the same ole thing year after year other than different buses and a few new faces. Jack is happy with the way it is on the scale he can handle. I on the other hand would like to see it grow even bigger. Maybe its because its during a special time of year, more peeple are coming this way anyway, and why not include it in your travels, that THIS rally should be special with special activities for EVERYONE!
I agree, not all music, food, or seminar topics will please everyone but with more choices, everyone could be pleased and want to and look forward to returning next year!
I guess what really got me to thinking was the fellow that said the rally was big enough! Granted I really like the small down home pot luck rallies where everyone knows everyone but Bussin is special, during a special time, and should show that it is special.
With all due respect to Jack for what has been done, I for one feel it could go further, attracting not only more buses but people in S&S too!
Another point I would like to make is the comment on rally fees. This sort of reminded me of MPG fuel talks. If your going to sqaubble over 1,2,3, mpg, why do you have a bus? If your going to worry about an extra 5-10-20 bucks, how come your not staying at a motel instead where you only get a TV and a bed that you don't know who slept in it before you! Pay whatever the charge is at a rally and get something for it!
Ok off my soap box but I DO appreciate the comments!
Ace

Ace,

Great idea for this thread.  Great idea for the annual get together.  Great idea for making it BIGGER.  Thanks for all that.

Idea....When my Dad was alive I used to take him down to Ft. Myers, Fl every year for the winter.  He lived in Pa. and winters were often brutal.  We stayed in a RV park named Pioneer Village.  It was enormous!  When checking in I was asked if I had any dogs on board and indeed I had two.  The clerk said I would have to stay in section ? and that it was commonly known as "Dog Patch".  Well when we arrived and got settled in we had 8 or 10 residents come over and welcome us like we were staying at their home.  Super friendly and we were told that the following day the street would be blocked of for the weekly pot luck and we were asked to come "without" a dish as we were new. At the Pot Luck I was introduced to the "Mayor of Dogpatch" who had been re elected for a fifth term.  Great fun was had by all.  I asked the guy next to me what breed of dog he owned and he said his wife was allergic and they had never owned a dog. :o  He shared that he found dog owners to be a breed apart and that he wouldn't live anywhere else on his vacation.  He shared that "there is no camaraderie like this anywhere else in the park.  You might want to keep an eye out for the size sufficient to support a "Dog Patch" at Jacks Rally.  We don't feel ostracized unless our site is under water and more than 60 yards from dry land.

I liked the idea of inter spacing the repeat visitors with the Newbees and maybe even buses and S&S.  Lotsa ideas floating around to interfere with your free choice and randomness. :D

Thanks again,

John

RJ,

I have made the last three BUS-N-USA rallies at RickReal. Orygun. :o  We have met and you don't remember. ???

At bus events I go by the pseudonym of "Phred". :-[  This for reasons of personal SAFTY. :P ::)  I'll see you there next year but I'll have a new pseudonym. ;D

Happy New year,

John

Quote from: Blacksheep on January 03, 2009, 10:34:14 AMThe return reply is usually centered around things to do. Let's face it, if it weren't for the personal junk for sale, times COULD get boring for some. Note I said could! I'm never bored. I'm always into something that satisfies ME, but I've been there 9 years! It's the newbies I'm concerned about!

I've not been to a Rally at all, but this comment strikes home. It seems that folks in America today are expecting to be entertained, rather than entertaining themselves. I see it at the sports car races that I attend. When I started in the sport many years ago, we'd all sit around the campfires drinking beer (or whatever) and talking about whatever we decided to talk about. The more we drank, the deeper (philosophically and bull-sh!@t-ally) the conversations got. It was fun. It was pretty entertaining, and newbies were welcome, and strongly encouraged. Today there are hardly any folks hanging out after the races. I guess good folks and good (bad?) conversation has disappeared in favor of the hotel room and a TV.

One day Natasha and I want to attend a rally, and it will probably be a smaller one. When things get too big folks tend to get too wound up trying to see everything rather than chatting with others. I know that's how I get sometimes, and it's hard to control.

Hope to see some of you in 2009.

Cheers,

- John

Well folks, I have been to a lot of bus rallies.  Been to all of MAKs except Biloxi >:(.  Been to all but one of Busn' USA events, three of Jacks rallies, several converted coach rallies and several Eagle Rallies.  We even went to the Hicks rally in MO this year.  I had fun at all of them!!  Each was different in its own way and I think that is good. 

MAKs rallies spanned the spectrum for the first one that folks have described to the last couple at the Caverns which were very laid back and much smaller.  I like both of them

The Hick's rally was very small but a lot of fun getting to know some new folks.  We had a great time till Pat broke her foot >:(

I do like to have planned food.  We are not particular, but it is fun to experience the food, and the friendship at the table. 

I don't care much for planned "greetings" for the new folks.  I just don't think that would work.  If each of made just a small effort to talk to folks you don't know, I think that would be plenty.  I do like name tags with name, location, and type of bus.  I think that really lets meeting folks much easier.  I am not good about going out of my way to meet new folks, but I pick away at it and am always glad that I did.

I have been both a presenter and attendee of seminars.  I went to Dick Wright, George Meyers, and Dave Galey's semainars many times each and always learned something new.  I have also enjoyed presenting seminars.  While the smaller rallies that don't have seminars are acceptable to me, I favor seminars.  I do agree that if there are seminars, there should be some planned for the ladies.  Pat always try to do a craft seminar if it works out.  The ladies seem to enjoy the activity and get to know one another.

Same is true of vendors.   Been on both sides.  Always enjoyed seeing was was offered by all of the vendors.

The Converted Coach group generally have one or more round tables (separate for the men and women).  That seems to go over pretty well.  Especially if there is a good moderator.

So, if you read between the lines, you will see that any bus rally is fine with me!!!!!  As the say, "all's good, some's better.  For bus rallies, I would shorten that to say:  all's good PERIOD!!!

Jim

Thanks for bringing this up, ACE!

I'll vote for 'em all!

Or, I'll vote for none?

As long as some like-minded hobbyists are parking together, more than likely a good time will be had by all.

Vendors and busnuts are a hard nut to crack....busnuts don't spend money the same way that some other of the vehicular hobbyists do... Vendors have to make a buck to warrant attendance. That is a challenge for which a rally organizer has no solution. Good stuff laid out in front of the coach swap meet style is excellent!

Larger rallies may dissuade those with unfinished coaches from attending?

Where else in life is ok to be not finished? Busnuts of all stripes must be seen to CELEBRATE the work in progress, the work yet to begin, the almost finished.... After all, really, what good is a finished bus conversion?  Newbies weren't around last year to know it's ok, heck, it's EXPECTED for you to show up with a cooler and a mattress on the floor!  And we need to remember to tell 'em about Flying J showers and just how easy it is to live a steel tent life. Heck, they'll be regarded with awe from some quarters....

Smaller rallies lack the critical mass for more formal activities?

But lend themselves to great fireside chats, music, story telling, spontaneous ideas and show me that in the middle of the night as 15 of us head off to get flashlights and manuals. At the rally repairs, upgrades and maintenance are popular spontaneous happenings, by choice or not!

Then, let's consider the FMCA experience.... Where the attendance is measured in THOUSANDS....
I just have to do at least one of those before they get outlawed...

I like to spend time with the people. Soak it up, listen, talk, party, hang out with people.

No matter the size or complexity, there must be lots of time for people to spend time with one another.

Don't make the mistake of trying to schedule all my time. I won't like it. Formal program is just the grease that gets the people moving in the same direction for awhile.

Food? Oh, yes, the other form of caloric intake...

As long as accessing the food doesn't take too long, and as noted, there's some left for those at the end of the line....ok, but if the rally food becomes a hindrance to the use of time...I'd rather grab a sandwich at the coach and keep moving, thank you very much.

happy coaching!
buswarrior